Player looting

[Rotku]

There's nothing inherently evil in looting a corpse.

[Keryn]

There's nothing inherently evil in looting a corpse.

The very thought he is dead and doesn't need it anymore seems quite valid as well...

And I loolz at the claim friends should take the corpse with all the loot. Friends or no friends, the guy is dead, a friend as any right to it as the guy who found it, simply because after the death the guy is no more, its a piece of meat, without rights, so finders keepers. If anything his family would get it, but... 99% of the PCs IG have no family that we know of. Lets just not get into ridiculous theories to favor some.

Also... whats wrong in using the armor of a known guy? So my Pc fins someone dead in the woods, likes the armor which is actually better then his own, removes it and keeps it. Latter on if asked about it, the answer is simple. I found the guy dead, gave him a proper burial and kept the armor. Makes perfect sense... leaving the armor there would be quite stupid!! Returning the items to its people or whatever already falls under the RP of the PC and the type of PC. And no one can force others to RP as they think it would be better, if it is not cheating it is ok!

The rule is good as it is, RP can come from it, and folks should RP accordingly.

[Darkmystic]

Well I feel this topic kinda aims at me. I will try to think out a good answer to give.

[Brokenbone]

If you have a PC die out someplace alone, it's completely your prerogative to drop a PM to your local DM team, describing the situation. Hey, band of goblins / gargoyles / skeletons / whatevers smoked my guy at insert location.

The chances of a DM acting on that in some fashion are much, much higher than some universal "NPC looting... yet somehow keeping the possibility of junk being in play" scripting ever being implemented.

DM hears the local sewer thugs got a score, well, maybe that enriches some thieves' guild that you don't know about, funds some goals of theirs for some plot movements... or just becomes "part of a hoard" for way later.

DM hears skeletons killed you, well, maybe they know their necromancer master doesn't personally visit that area too often, and the dead may lay where they fell for a long while, the skeletons being mindless, non-greedy etc.

You get the picture.

There may also be cases where DM just says "thanks", does nothing about it, decides a 100% "intact" corpse will just be there for some lucky soul.

Dropping a line to a DM is about 100x more appropriate than dropping hints to buddies (whether to enrich 'em or for hope of raise), or replying to requests for hints. I suppose once in a blue moon a death could even end up "adjusted" to less than one if some bug was discovered (oops those ogre barbs were triple spawning, there should've been only one there...) or if the foes were doing a lot of taking of prisoners rather than killing, for their secret slave filled mine plot or something.

Check this out though, and that I'm only "hazily" understanding of right now. If you have your basic NPC hostile, and for whatever reason dropped 10,000gp in gear on him... on death, he's not going to drop it. ACR loot scripts are going to figure out what the kill was "worth" and stuff eligible within some generated amount is going to drop. Again I have not DM'd in ALFA's NWN2, but I gather this has been a surprise once or twice for DMs sticking valuables on "boss" critters and whatnot, fully intending a critter to drop a plot item of value, but the scripts prevent that. Seeding "chests" therefore is a workaround, but of little comfort if the DM really, really wanted the local badguy chief to be wearing stolen plate armor and wielding a +1 wpn, and dropping them on death.

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Anyhow, as to the kickoff post, desire of / jealousy of "loots" I share the suspicion can drive some bad behaviours. DMs are asked to award within XP-to-gp tied guidelines (Swift mentions the XP tools remind people "hey for this much XP, this much GP should've been going along with it..."), but a PC corpse breaks all the rules, as it's NOT a DM award. Stumble across a PC with 300gp, get 300gp. Stumble across one with 13,000gp, get 13,000gp.

That said, if PC A dies, PCs B, C, and D, grab his loot and sell some, wear some, stow some, etc., all good, but if it turns out PCs E, F, and G were good buds with PC A, and faction XYZ named him a member too, B C and D best have remarkable social skills or be the toughest SOBs around, as irritated friends / family / employers may start out polite in terms of having a say in a winding up of the deader's affairs, but it's a world full of swords and sorcery, sometimes those get used too in order to bring about a desired resolution (maybe in subdual... maybe not).

[johnlewismcleod]

Will this apply to when PC's loot enemy NPC corpses?

I mean, if you get alignment shifts for looting a corpse of a person you havent had a hand in killing, praxis would say that there would be HUGE reprecussions for looting someone you actually DID kill.

And that'd probably lead to the imprisonment and evil turning of the entire adventure population in Faerun

Ahhh...I see where you might get the impression I meant that, but no...as Rotku pointed out, looting is not evil. Looting is a mainstay of adventuring, in fact. For many PC's looting a friend's corpse would impact their alignment IMO, but certainly not all. It's just another tool in the DM arsenal to "keep it real". Looting is an IC act, but often players do it so reflexively that it seems OOC.

We play in a permadeath world. When a PC dies it is significant. The player of the dead PC wants the death to be real and have impact. When his friends are more concerned with his goods than his death it is OOC injurious to the player of the dead PC, and usually OOC for most PC's IMO.

But each instance is unique and must be dealt with as such.

[Brokenbone]

Hmm, just rereading a couple things, I would add, do not assume much of anything about silly stuff like armor size. We do not have any rules for "captured armor" modification, it's sorta just one size fits all (none of the 2d4x100 for captured plate).

I bet I know what Mithral Shirt was being given in an example, may have been one found in a set of crypts with a bunch of other "elf junk", so possibly all "elf sized", even if only a gnome found it worth wearing. Just as if someone bought used armor off a giant half-orc, there's a handwave of "uh, guess it gets resized", just as how it would've come from a dead partymate who needed no rez with a similar "uh, guess it got resized" too.

Sure, distinctive "stuff" might be noticeable (color scheme, an armor part that's distinctive, a crest on a shield, etc.), but at least in the realm of NPC merchants, let's assume they're dealing with Faerun, full of adventurers, not just the 20 regular players on any regular server. Merchants aren't just boiling shoe leather and eating the soup without "us", they're trading with all sorts of other nice n' nasty sorts, NPCs, with their own tales of goblin farming and lucky finds.

PS - I am a frequent lucky finder. I think in all cases though corpses end up at a temple, the newly found city morgue in a particular building in BG, or in one case due to IC recognition of a body, at a faction HQ. Usually they still have some clothes on at least. At least one very wealthy dwarf though ended up stripped to nothing and left in the sewer, although left with a bottle of rotgut and posed artfully. For that, I blame Creslyn.

[NESchampion]

But each instance is unique and must be dealt with as such.

Agree entirely. As an example, if your best friend dies you may not take his things out of respect, or you may if he stated he wanted his things distributed. If bandit on the road tries to kill you and you kill him, you are not very likely to give much crap about whether or not his friends want his stuff, you'll probably want recompense for the potions you were forced to use.

[johnlewismcleod]

Heh...My bandits are very protective of their stolen property. Loot them at your own risk

And agreed with previous...looting is a mainstay of adventuring. Keep it IC and real and there is no problem.

Go meta or get caught slipping armour out of a corpse in front of interested witnesses and walking off as if it is tucked in your cod-piece...expect problems.

[Brokenbone]

Come to think, all loot has the prospect of causing problems, doesn't it? Three shinies and four adventurers become much easier to figure out if the odd man is thrown down a mine shaft.

[dergon darkhelm]

I *love* looting a dead PC!


There. I said it. There is a rush like finding a $20 bill on the ground mixed with the excitement of a wrapped present. You see that corpse in the distance and your heart starts to race. Will it have potions?! Will it have a magic wand?! C'mon C'mon!

If I IC knew the PC, then that relationship would guard my PC's actions toward the loot. If I didn't, then it's just some poor dead bastard and I'm taking his sh*t.

If anyone else is around then RPing big theft is a must. I also give sleight of hand checks whenever I am looting something cool and trying not to be noticed. (( OOC- Hey, you meatagaming bastards! Just because I rolled a s.o.h check doesn't mean that you're now somehow magically attuned to my halfling's every move! I've taken now to rolling them every 20 min or so while adventuring jsut to throw you punks off my trail. ))


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And I can't remember who it was in NWN1...I think jmecha... who totally set up a metagamer's death trap by causally remarking in irc that his guy with the +2 sword short died "in that cavern in the woods". Just so happenend that was a complete lie just to see who he could tempt into cheating to look for the corpse in a cave with a basilisk spawn in it.


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In closing: Viva la corpse l3wt!

[johnlewismcleod]

Have I mentioned recently that jmecha is my hero?

[Tegid]

You guys are awesome, truly. I guess my earlier post was pretty bitter but I really like the game here. And the last thing I wanna do is be divisive with shadowy accusations. I'm aloof as it is.

[johnlewismcleod]

Not at all Tegid...what happened was inexcusable and you were right to be offended. It offended many of us and that's what set this post alight. Despite the occasional lapse in judgement such as you described, our community is composed of the finest RPers anywhere...just ask me.

If it happens again do as Keryn suggested...turn the bugger over to the PA and don't feel bad about it. Or do as jmecha did and we'll all have a good laugh over it

[Creslyn]

At least one very wealthy dwarf though ended up stripped to nothing and left in the sewer, although left with a bottle of rotgut and posed artfully. For that, I blame Creslyn.

It was a nice bottle of rotgut though.

[Blindhamsterman]

generally... my toon just loots coin/scrolls/potions. he would probably take other small useful items too, but I can't remember the last time i looted the armour and weapons off a dead PC. Generally he has no need for such items... so he wouldn't take em. He probably would take a suit of mithril armour, its useful and rare (or should be) But, taking off armour shouldn't leave someone naked... it should leave thme in the clothes they had beneath.

With close allies, the above still counts. small useful items - could keep elenaril alive, while his old friend will no longer need them. Often the situation will decide how looting of a corpse goes down though. For instance...

on thursday a member of our campaign died, nearly half the party also did at the same time. When it happened, the body vanished (bug) but we opted to carry it through dangerous territory - because he was an ally and deserved better. When we get a chance to take the items he had that could keep us alive... we will. And then we'll give the man a burial before trying not to get killed from there on.