Suggestion: Player/DMs on TSM

MShady · Post by **MShady** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 9:47 pm

Understandable Nick. Thats why we have to be very careful in selection of DMs to do this.

While I understand feeling uncomfortable, we are in a dire need for DMs or the project doesn't work. We aren't in a position of having the luxury here. We need to weigh both sides agains the other and realistically, we need coverage alot more.

mr duncan · Post by **mr duncan** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 10:25 pm

NickD wrote:Oh, please no. No DMing on the server you play on!.

agreed, let us not complain to hard about the heat of the frying pan, the situation will be worse for being "fixed"

J

White Warlock · Post by **White Warlock** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:53 pm

Solutions are found by action, not by fear of action.

Individualized concerns should not trump group concerns.

Want another?

How about, "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one." - Mr. Spock

oldgrayrogue · Post by **oldgrayrogue** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 1:20 am

I have always been of the mind that as players we play this game together, not in competition with each other. At least that is my perspective. Any DM who would retaliate against a player for IC actions against the DM's character probably should not be playing this game at all, let alone DMing. Perhaps give something like this a try on a trial basis and if it doesn't work stop?

Post by **paazin** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 1:26 am

I just want to throw in that I'm supportive of a solution of this vein - with the proper safeguards and methodology in place, it's a good idea.

I'm unsure as to how the other Admin or HDMs view this issue, but I feel tackling this is a step in the right direction for ALFA as a whole.

Swift · Post by **Swift** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 2:59 am

Rick7475 wrote:Make it easier for TSM DM's by getting rid of the DM APP ) how many many many many many many many times have I said that???)

I have not seen the current DM App, but it never used to be a problem. What changes rusty has made to it and the timeframe it takes may be an issue, but the app itself should be kept (maybe modified to pull any BS Rusty inserted into it).

Inaubryn · Post by **Inaubryn** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 3:20 am

paazin wrote:I just want to throw in that I'm supportive of a solution of this vein - with the proper safeguards and methodology in place, it's a good idea.

I'm unsure as to how the other Admin or HDMs view this issue, but I feel tackling this is a step in the right direction for ALFA as a whole.

It's currently working for Exodus after 10+ months. We've not had single issue with it. And if the DMs are cheating or meta-gaming, or whatever, they're really good at not getting caught. Anyway, I think this can work for ALFA as well.

psycho_leo · Post by **psycho_leo** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 4:07 am

Swift wrote: I have not seen the current DM App, but it never used to be a problem. What changes rusty has made to it and the timeframe it takes may be an issue, but the app itself should be kept (maybe modified to pull any BS Rusty inserted into it).

Looks to be the same app I filled about an year ago when I DMed Daggerdale. While I think it would kind of silly for me to answer those questions again, it wouldn't stop me from DMing if I wanted to.

Post by **paazin** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 4:57 am

Swift wrote: I have not seen the current DM App, but it never used to be a problem. What changes rusty has made to it and the timeframe it takes may be an issue, but the app itself should be kept (maybe modified to pull any BS Rusty inserted into it).

http://www.alandfaraway.org/applyDM.php

http://www.alandfaraway.org/docs/Player/DMApp

It's not too bad, honestly - about 15-30 minutes to fill out. If someone wants to DM yet they don't feel like spending a few minutes on the app, well, it kind of speaks for itself.

Rick7475 · Post by **Rick7475** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 6:12 am

Well, hey, if the current DM App for DM's that have already DM'ed for years on ALFA isn't a problem, then why have so many other former DM's, like myself, Indio, and several others refused it? And why aren't DM's flocking to the table? Check the threads, how many former DMs in good standing, great ones, have voiced that they are pissed off about filling out a DM App again with such redundent questions because it is INSULTING TO THEIR COMMITTMENTS.

And since we already filled the stupid thing out when were first DM's why do we need to do it again. Since it is virtually unchanged WHY?

You all don't get it, do you? You need to take a PR course. It is about RESPECT. People who have DM'ed on ALFA for years, built servers, HDMed, were LAs, PAs, and so on, have to fill out a DM App to DM, with the same questions as the original DM App. ONE THEY ALREADY FILLED OUT, THE SAME QUESTIONS

Do you get it yet!!!! No you dont!!!! Tell you what, take a stroll to Exodus and look at how they run things. No stupid red tape, BS, and RESPECT!

You want DMs, the ones who are proven and have been major contributors to ALFA, yet you treat them like a brand new DM who has never DMed on ALFA with an assanine DM APP that they have already filled out! And you dont get it by now, wholly fuck, are you all dense or what!!!!!

WELCOME TO THE ALFA THAT TRUSTS NO ONE!!!!!

AND THAT IS WHY PEOPLE ARE LEAVING. LOOK AT THE SERVER NUMBERS! LOOK AT THE LACK OF DMs.

JaydeMoon · Post by **JaydeMoon** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 6:48 am

THE END TIMES ARE NIGH!

OURS IS DESERVED DAMNATION!!!!

Swift · Post by **Swift** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 7:51 am

Rick7475 wrote:Well, hey, if the current DM App for DM's that have already DM'ed for years on ALFA isn't a problem, then why have so many other former DM's, like myself, Indio, and several others refused it? And why aren't DM's flocking to the table? Check the threads, how many former DMs in good standing, great ones, have voiced that they are pissed off about filling out a DM App again with such redundent questions because it is INSULTING TO THEIR COMMITTMENTS.

And since we already filled the stupid thing out when were first DM's why do we need to do it again. Since it is virtually unchanged WHY?

You all don't get it, do you? You need to take a PR course. It is about RESPECT. People who have DM'ed on ALFA for years, built servers, HDMed, were LAs, PAs, and so on, have to fill out a DM App to DM, with the same questions as the original DM App. ONE THEY ALREADY FILLED OUT, THE SAME QUESTIONS

Do you get it yet!!!! No you dont!!!! Tell you what, take a stroll to Exodus and look at how they run things. No stupid red tape, BS, and RESPECT!

You want DMs, the ones who are proven and have been major contributors to ALFA, yet you treat them like a brand new DM who has never DMed on ALFA with an assanine DM APP that they have already filled out! And you dont get it by now, wholly f*sk, are you all dense or what!!!!!

WELCOME TO THE ALFA THAT TRUSTS NO ONE!!!!!

AND THAT IS WHY PEOPLE ARE LEAVING. LOOK AT THE SERVER NUMBERS! LOOK AT THE LACK OF DMs.

No offense Rick, but stop being a dick. Everything you reference in this post is something Rusty had direct control over. Could he have waived the DM App for returning DMs or only pushed the standards part if they had not completed it? Yes. Did he? No. That is hardly a failing of the DM app, that is a direct failing of the now departed DMA and any changes he made and enforced.

As i have said, we have had a DM App for a long time, and it has never caused an issue. When Ava was DMA and i was responsible for DM Apps, i was told that if a DM was returning, the app was essentially just a formality to have a hard copy of their agreement to follow standards, and to ensure they were processed quickly. Never heard any complaints about a lack of respect then.

Like it or not, alot of the processes in the DMA portfolio were there long before Rusty ever stepped into the role. Your grievance is with Rusty and how he ran things, which i find to be quite valid, but continuing to try and push those grievances on the actual processes themselves is just pointless.

If you have valid concerns about the DM App outside of the crap Rusty imposed and enforced, by all means bring them up, but there is nothing in your post to that effect.

psycho_leo · Post by **psycho_leo** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 12:09 pm

Typing in CAPS and calling others dense or stupid was never the way to get things changed. It just gets you less simpathy. DMA elections will start soon and I'm positive any of the candidates will be at least more prone to compromise on the subject than Rusty was. The DM app process has been here for years with the same questions, so it's unreasonable to believe it will be completely dropped.

Post by **paazin** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 12:30 pm

Rick, returning DMs don't even have to fill out the app fully:

# Q: What if I am a returning DM?
# A: You still need to send in an application, but don't worry about all of the questions. Just make sure that you indicate your prior experience DMing in ALFA, and if you have a current DM providing a reference for you. Also, don't forget to add any questions you have for DMA Staff, and to agree to learn and abide by our Standards!

It's for those who are new or just choose to

ThinkTank · Post by **ThinkTank** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 12:32 pm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_complex