Planetouched DM vote result

Nyarlathotep · Post by **Nyarlathotep** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:31 pm

The gensai models are horrid, to such an extent I don't know if most of thsoe models could even work as NPC gensai. They really seem more suited to half elementals or even full blooded demons (tentacles on the head seem more suited to a servitor of Dagon than any elemental I've seen). From an NPC side a human model with maybe an odd skin tone and red hair would work far better for a fire gensai than what has been given.

Rotku · Post by **Rotku** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:43 pm

Mayhem wrote:
Danubus wrote: I want this project to succeed so bad sometimes and then I see such a stupid move like the ones the DMs made by voting against Planetouched races.
Well, they only edged it out by one vote. If only there were some way you could have been eligible to vote, you could have swung it in your favoured direction.

Three.

Inaubryn · Post by **Inaubryn** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:43 pm

Jayde, just a note. I usually say what I mean. If you wanna take my comments as such, fine by me. I can't stop you. I'm not upset mind you. You are certainly entitled to your opinion. And you say a significantly large number of DMs voted. Well, we have people who don't, never have, and have no plans to DM, voting. I don't find this sort of representation all that accurate. Do you?

AL, understood. I'm not real fond of Obsidian's depiction of them either, but we also can just write a few lines in the color and head options 2da for them and open up other non-ostentatious looks for them.

And, it would seem that certain people continue sniping and making inflammatory remarks toward me personally. It seems these people still haven't gotten over things that happened over a year ago and then some. This is a very female-like grudge to hold. I've addressed these people once and have been asked not to address these people again by the Lead Administrator here in ALFA. Yet, these people keep addressing me. So... to the Lead Administrator... if these people keep addressing me, I will have to forgo all maturity and respond. Because, it seems as though these people have not been properly handled. Then again, we do know that no matter what these people do wrong, they we'll never actually be endanger of any real repercussion. That's not an indictment of the Lead, as these people have been engaging in this distasteful behavior pretty much since these people have been in ALFA. Others have been booted for such behavior, but low and behold, these people are still here. As I said... we have a tendency to be inconsistent.

Just wanna cite this posted not even a month ago.

http://www.alandfaraway.org/phpbbforum/ ... hp?t=36824

Brokenbone · Post by **Brokenbone** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:43 pm

Reasonable people can disagree.

The art in the "Monsters of Faerun" compendium represents a pretty freaky image for Genasi at least.

Maybe that's fair though. Creatures so marked by their heritage, that it's a warning sign that they're otherworldly, and possessing otherworldly talents. Saying "looks 99.9% like a human, except the soles of both feet are scaled, which this water genasi scrupulously hides" or "looks 99.9% elven, except this tiefling farts cinnamon smelling vapors", those are potentially metagame-level disadvantages, i.e., things which can easily be hid. I guess exceptions could be DMs outing PCs... "Your shoes fall off! You have gas!"

Anyhow, just a limited comment that maybe some folks have strong impressions on the "look" of planetouched, whether from fairly current Faerun related resources, or from the art of the whole Planescape line (a lot of Tony DiTerlizzi stuff really set a theme, which I remember well and still enjoy).

Inwintersshadow · Post by **Inwintersshadow** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:48 pm

Personal opinion I could see them allowed on some servers and not on others depending on the theme. Much in the ways its unwise to bring say a half/orc into Daggerdale or an elf into Selgaunt.

Veilan · Post by **Veilan** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:50 pm

So...

just because opinions concerning planetouched may have been formed based on other PWs, playing groups, campaigns or PnP games somehow makes those sentiments "not based on empiric evidence"?

Think again Inny, most of us have their own experiences with the races, and many of us played or DMed them. And many may extrapolate from their ALFA experiences with smurfs and company.
You don't need to taste it in that particular stew to realize nutmeg may be awful in your soup. I'm personally slightly in favour of planetouched as a playing race, just not for an ALFA-style PW. Maybe I'm just an awesome abstractive mind

.

Add on top of that this seems to be a kind of nutmeg that has to be intricately prepared, weighed and always monitored before consumption, and I think we're getting to the core of it.

And, yeah, I think it was out of the question that if we had had genasi, people like AL would have had to put up effort and thought into how to make feasible acceptable models, modifying human skin / hair templates and the like.

But hey... no additional work

.

As for the "fear-mongering" arguments, there's a nice saying... who sits in the glass-house, should not throw rocks.

Inaubryn · Post by **Inaubryn** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:56 pm

I guess, the glass house addage relates to me as far as I'm afraid that we're killing ALFA. Hell, I know we are just looking at the sheer number of people that have left over time and looking at how few people remain. But, it seems as though we do everything we can to kill it a little bit more everyday.

And, actually there's very little work involved in opening up more head anc color choices for planetouched. I know because I did it with half-elves before they created half-drow in the xpansion. It's relatively easy to do. You just have to add the desired color and head entries to the appropriate 2das. Might take an hour at most, and that's a liberal estimate. So, yep, no extra work at all.

Not to mention I've DM's just as long or longer as most here. So, I've seen many and plenty of varied concepts, races, classes, stories, etc. There was never any extra work for me. Hell, it's more work to add things to the module to accomodate PCs than it is to roleplay with a offbeat PC race. Tell me I'm wrong on that.

JaydeMoon · Post by **JaydeMoon** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:58 pm

Let's redefine the voting constituency from DMs to:

People who currently build, script, create guidelines, and DM for ALFA's servers and care enough to vote.

A simple majority of THOSE don't want to bother. srsly

Oh, and I dont' want any nutmeg in my pizza, kthxbai

JaydeMoon · Post by **JaydeMoon** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:00 pm

Oh, and Brokenbone's post > Nyar's points.

Those seem to be cannon representations of genasi...

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:09 pm

Nutmeg is perfect in a spinach and potato soup.

Brokenbone · Post by **Brokenbone** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:09 pm

Clarifying I'm not meaning to "fight" about what they ought look like. In some prior thread Nyar mentioned the whole "came into D&D through a road other than Tolkien" bit, Merlin as a demon, various other mythos involving otherworldly parentage, etc., and I can respect that viewpoint.

I'm no artist myself, but I always liked all the Planescape art and whatnot, and it formed strong impressions (worth at least 1000 words) on look and feel of certain races. Much like looking at the old 2nd edition series of boring Monstrous Compendiums (which you'd clip into a big fat binder) and saying "ho hum" at the pen and ink, non color, Tanaari & Baatezu, versus opening up a Planescape Compendium or miscellaneous sourcebook and seeing at first the DiTerlizzi art, or later, other artists' conceptions of that campaign setting.

Googling images under "Genasi", you come up, always, with similarly stylized stuff, unless you accidentally catch a real live human being with the last name "Genasi", accepting an award or doing something else people named "Genasi" do. Heh, again though, Google-a-bility isn't going to set any style codes either.

I guess if published materials say the equivalent "may look normal but be stinky" for say, tieflings, I can accept that, though again, it doesn't meet my expectations set by the artwork on point. They'd feel watered down to me in some sense. Again though, my opinion only, and again, not really touching on any of the core disagreements of recent polls. Just spending a minute on the art is all... maybe Obsidian made the models like that since that's how all the published artwork looks. *shrugs*

Nyarlathotep · Post by **Nyarlathotep** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:10 pm

Well artwork isn't really canon or else we'd have a lot of freakish things

FRCS presents them a bit more normal

The written material does present fairly subtle signs;

Races of faerun (most complete list)

Aasimar (look human except for one distinguishing charecteristic)

Golden eyes
silver hair
feathers at shoulder (not wings unless they take a racial feat)
feathers in hair
pearly opalescent eyes
powerful ringing voice
silvery or golden skin
iridescent scales in small patches

Air Gensai (human with one or two features)

light blue skin
pale white skin
white hair
light blue hair
a constant slight breeze in presence
flesh that is cool to the touch
voice that can be heard over any nonmagical wind
any sudden movement accompanied by whistling wind

Earth Gensai (one or two)

earthlike skin
eyes like black pits
eyes like gems
gravelly voice
very large hands and feet
iron gray hair
sweats mud instead of water
metallic sheen to skin or hair

Fire Gensai

charcoal gray skin
deep red skin
red or orange hair that waves like flames
eyes that glow when gensai are angry
unusually warm skin
large red teeth
smells like smoke

Water Gensai
lightly sclaed skin
clammy flesh
blue green skin or hair
large blue black eyes
webbed hands and feet

Tiefling

small horns
fangs or pointed teeth
forked tongue
glowing red eyes
cat eyes
more or less than five fingers
goat legs
hooves
non-prehensile tail
furry, leathery or scaly skin
bruised blue skin
no shadow
no reflection
skin is hot to touch
smell of brimstone

Earth, and Fire gensai are both said to be obviously not human while Air,Aasimar, Tiefling and Water are said to look human with exception of one or two charecteristics. So basically some seem almost completely human, some seem other but with charecteristics that can be as indicative of elf blood as planar, and some are fairly bizarre.

Edit: And the hilly billy in the hat at the far right reminds me of Caleb

Mord · Post by **Mord** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:18 pm

Rusty wrote:Nutmeg is perfect in a spinach and potato soup.

I call shenanigans.

JaydeMoon · Post by **JaydeMoon** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:31 pm

The obvious answer is to allow Aasimar and air and water genasi and disallow fire, earth, and tieflings (sorry, but with those horns, they don't make the cut).

Twiggy · Post by **Twiggy** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 8:33 pm

Why not fire or ban all the people that voted no and replace them with ones that will vote yes? A bit silly or harsh perhaps? Maybe but I find it less distasteful and painful than berating them for disagreeing until they get tired of it and leave.