Crafting system

[Fionn]

before we figure out what to craft, we need a firm answer on /why/. Is it for RP, time sink while waiting for a game, access to custom items, alternative to 'adventuring'...?

[Maeva]

before we figure out what to craft, we need a firm answer on /why/. Is it for RP, time sink while waiting for a game, access to custom items, alternative to 'adventuring'...?

Unfortunately it's all of the above.

Each player is a specific personality and have a specific RP/play style, that's what makes everyone of us unique.
One cannot plan things out for any one specific personality or RP style, it would have to be a broad generalization that does the best to touch each and every personality or RP style.

[Ronan]

I don't think crafting needs its own forum. Its related to and effects other systems in the ACR & basemod, especially when it comes to crafting components and finished products. If people naysay in inflamitory ways, I'll just delete their posts.

I started a new thread based on the conclusions reached in GD:
http://www.alandfaraway.org/phpbbforum/ ... hp?t=31776

[Rick7475]

I don't think crafting needs its own forum. Its related to and effects other systems in the ACR & basemod, especially when it comes to crafting components and finished products. If people naysay in inflamitory ways, I'll just delete their posts.

I started a new thread based on the conclusions reached in GD:
http://www.alandfaraway.org/phpbbforum/ ... hp?t=31776

I respectfully disagree. I believe that it needs its own forum and its own team.

I am not really interested in arguing why or why not we should have crafting. The membership has voted that they want it. So I am saying that I want to put it in. If it means contributing to someone else's idea, then perhaps I can contribute, or perhaps not.

But I would like to do it. I have ideas of how it will be implemented based on my experience with other crafting systems and my software engineering experience.

I don't really care if someone here posts that they don't want it. I don't really care to hear all the if's and but's because we don't even have a system to if and but about. Creating items is in the DMG and there are feats in the PHB. Creating and crafting is part of DnD.

If you will allow me to have a forum with volunteers who want to contribute, I will put together a blue print for people to comment on.

Until then, there is no point in arguing merits until there is something on paper. There won't be anything on paper unless we have a private forukm to discuss how to do it instead of why we need it.

[Ronan]

Anything going in the ACR and/or base pallet (and the crafting system goes in each) needs to be seen by everyone working on them. Myself, Cipher, Fionn, and others need to be able to comment. Everyone has good input from time to time (we keep Fionn around, don't we? ).

I've yet to see any flaming in NWN2 tech, but of course there are people who question the wisdom of certain features. Often times people don't take a close look at specs until they are near completion, and we've had many instances where someone says "Hey, that feature makes no sense at all" and been correct. As you said, D&D has crafting. So ultimately the debate is not whether or not ALFA should have crafting, but what form ALFA's crafting should take. If bitches about crafting in general, I'll just delete their posts. I won't have any of that shit in technical forums.

The NWN1 crafting team had its own forum, and nothing came of it. The system they proposed was just a re-hashed version of 3.5 crafting, actually missing a few things, with some minor alterations and DM rules/suggestions.

Anyways, it looks like the only argument going on now is what to do about time spent crafting. Fionn and Mulu both have valid points, and I can't think of a suitable compromise at the moment. But developement can start without knowing that particular piece of information, anyhow. A basic framework for recipes probably needs to be created first.

Your naturally welcome to do whatever you want in a private forum. But at some point the feature specification and implementation need to be present in NWN2: Technical.

[Fionn]

before we figure out what to craft, we need a firm answer on /why/. Is it for RP, time sink while waiting for a game, access to custom items, alternative to 'adventuring'...?

Unfortunately it's all of the above.

Each player is a specific personality and have a specific RP/play style, that's what makes everyone of us unique.
One cannot plan things out for any one specific personality or RP style, it would have to be a broad generalization that does the best to touch each and every personality or RP style.

No, it *can* be all of the above. If we wish to support RP/party-quest 95% of the time, and also allow crafting by the same people in a 'reasonable time, then we need to nix any time constraints IG. If we instead wish players to use NPCs for 'vending machine' crafting, we can require that PCs choose where to spend their time. If we wish it only to be an IC time sink, then we need not worry about specific items, and can just set a low GP/Hr of profitable items to craft.

I think it's only Mulu requesting we allow Adventurers to both adventure and craft, and that the boring crafting should be assumed during downtime. If I'm wrong, I want to know before we plan out a system, then try to implement that plan.

I think also, that we do wish to allow PCs to craft all mundane & most 'common' magical items. I think we actually want *all* items, but it's hard to script the pricing for a Longsword +1, +2 vs Evil, +3 vs Orcs, Flaming d6, 80% weight, Cast Spell Bless 1/day (harder if we modify item properties in a patch).

Rick - can you start a thread for this? If we get randomized and Ronan can't keep us on topic, we can then request a private forum for it. Likely General Scripting would do nicely ;)

[Ronan]

Rick - can you start a thread for this? If we get randomized and Ronan can't keep us on topic, we can then request a private forum for it. Likely General Scripting would do nicely

http://www.alandfaraway.org/phpbbforum/ ... hp?t=31776
And hopefully in NWN2 tech, when we get more detailed. I'll move any threads if anything gets out of hand, but so far I only see logical discussion.

[Mulu]

Just to double post, I already posted in the other thread that I think having a crafting system for peeps with low play time *and* having it be an activity to occupy you when no DM's are around is simply irreconcialable. Make the system a time consuming activity for those who are online and bored, or just interested in being a crafter. Let it be known up front that it takes a lot of time to craft anything of worth, and that not all players will have sufficient play time to pursue it in a meaningful way.

Do realize that any aspect of crafting that boils down to watching the clock tick will result in players going afk and their PC's becoming nonresponsive to the world, which obviously breaks immersion.

[Fionn]

Let it be known up front that it takes a lot of time to craft anything of worth, and that not all players will have sufficient play time to pursue it in a meaningful way.

2nd. Not that you can't take a year to make a MW sword (or enchant it), just we aren't allowing adventurers to be full time crafters in their off time.

Anyone have an objection?

[Rusty]

Bump.

[Mulu]

I assume we're just going to continue this thread for crafting issues.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned, at least I don't remember it being mentioned, is just how much extra lag crafting creates due to huge numbers of items in inventories. There's a big debate going on at Avlis about the issue.

http://www.avlis.org/viewtopic.php?t=90642&start=0

[Rick7475]

I think we need to just adopt something of a prototype and test it out.

One thing that has haunted ALFA is the inability to put crafting in.

In a sense, it is like a server project. It is quite involved and needs a dedicated team.

It is a software engneering project in that it needs a blue print, a time frame, testing, and the whole lot.

So, what we need is a 'crafting team', a lead, 2 - 3 builders, and some testers.

I also suggest maybe we something off the shelf, an exisitng system.

[White Warlock]

huge inventories of crafting equipment happen because they are working with the default crafting system, which needs to be cleaned up quite a bit, and with the default lewt system, which provides crafting components on just about every kill. Crafting components should be buy only in all but the rare components. If a particular item requires a dragon's left nipple, a dm will have to run a campaign with that component as one of the prized items to obtain.

Think solutions people... solutions.

[HEEGZ]

I also suggest maybe we something off the shelf, an exisitng system.

From the CTC forum:

What Will And Will Not Be Happening

• The CTC forum is not the place to engage in Crafting Doomthreads ™.
• Any Crafting proposal will have to take full account of ALFA’s wealth standards.
• Any Crafting proposal will have to take realistic account of scripting and technical resources, i.e. practicability.
• As much use as possible should be made of the NWN2 Crafting system and resources.
• Static crafting will be limited to mundane items, i.e. up to Masterwork.
• Magical crafting will be DM-run.
• Scrolls and potions may be excepted from this rule and be crafted statically.
• The creation of a fully static magical crafting system is, for now, not for discussion.

http://www.alandfaraway.org/phpbbforum/ ... hp?t=34164

Anyone interested in joining the crafting team should contact Rusty who is coordinating efforts there.

[Rotku]

Solutions? Bah! Solutions are for the weak!