I was once strongly infavor of legalizing prostitution (and given my ... um ... past, I suppose thats not too surprising). However, I have since got educated on the subject of human trafficking - Kamala Harris, the San Francisco DA, is one of the leading lights in the fight against human trafficking here in the U.S. and she has conducted talks and symposiums on the subject.
So, how does this change my view? Well, I still think there is nothing inherently wrong with prostitution - its payment for services. In that respect, paying a pretty girl for sex is no different than paying a strong man for digging ditches or paying a smart person to practice law. Except of course our 2,000 years of Christian-developed intolerance for sex. But setting that aside, I see no problem with the basic transaction.
Unfortunately, the business is not so clean. To paraphrase one particularly observant commentator, the Johns don't want middle-aged white women walking down the street protesting for their sex-worker rights - the majority of Johns want young girls, as young as they can get them, and they want different ones regularly. This means that the purveyors of sex services have a strong financial incentive to develop an unending flow of young women for the enjoyment of the Johns. And while there maybe many women, like myself, who willingly turn to prostitution for one reason or another, there are not nearly enough to fill the demand. So, we get the international trade in women.
And that, I have BIG problems with. Its slavery. And that I cannot stand. And unfortunately legalizing prostitution simply makes it easier for the human-traffickers to ply their business, and the legal bordellos come under serious financial pressure to take part in such illicit trafficking. Those bordellos, madames and pimps who have a steady stream of fresh young women are more likely to do well financially than those that don't - and a steady stream of fresh young women who have no say in how much they are paid, and who have no freedom to quit is the best of all for those businesses. And so the human trafficking thrives.
So, given the awful nature of human trafficking and the sex-slave trade, I have to say I am agains the legalization of prostitution until we find a way to deal with the illicit trafficking. If all the girls working the streets and bordellos were there of their own accord, so be it - but thats not the way things are right now.
On the other hand, since many, if not most of the girls currently involved in the sex trade in many big cities (San Francisco included, with its dozens of "massage parlors") are not in this willingly, I find it unjust to prosecute the girls. Prosecute the traffickers, the pimps, the madames and the Johns, but not some poor girl from the country side of China who tried to find a better life and ended up getting enslaved.
The Goddess Bunny
Of course, the obvious counter argument to that is that women are imported and used as property anyway when it's not legal, so there would be no further harm in legalising prostitution, and it would take prostitution out of the hands of criminals. And then the counter to the counter argument is that all it does is legitimise the criminals and their practices. And so on.
One could argue, however, that by legalising prostitution it would become significantly easier to investigate and resolve the human trafficing problems.
But anyway, my issue is they went a bit too far and legalised pretty much everything, street walking included. Street walking is illegal even in The Netherlands. I think all prostitution should be carried out in a licenced premises, and the prostitutes required to carry out medical checks (read AIDS test) once a month.
As a side note, I am told that prostitution in New Zealand is not making a lot of money at the moment. Apparently brothels are no longer making money as people are tightening their belts with the downturn in the economy. I also suspect the market has been over-saturated. Although, as far as I am aware, there is no brothel in Auckland marketed towards gay men... the people most likely not to have dependants and higher income than hetero men...
One could argue, however, that by legalising prostitution it would become significantly easier to investigate and resolve the human trafficing problems.
But anyway, my issue is they went a bit too far and legalised pretty much everything, street walking included. Street walking is illegal even in The Netherlands. I think all prostitution should be carried out in a licenced premises, and the prostitutes required to carry out medical checks (read AIDS test) once a month.
As a side note, I am told that prostitution in New Zealand is not making a lot of money at the moment. Apparently brothels are no longer making money as people are tightening their belts with the downturn in the economy. I also suspect the market has been over-saturated. Although, as far as I am aware, there is no brothel in Auckland marketed towards gay men... the people most likely not to have dependants and higher income than hetero men...
Current PCs:
NWN1: Soppi Widenbottle, High Priestess of Yondalla.
NWN2: Gruuhilda, Tree Hugging Half-Orc
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NWN2: Gruuhilda, Tree Hugging Half-Orc
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fluffmonster
- Haste Bear
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A woman in sexual slavery can at least consider appealing to the law when prostitution is legal. When its illegal, not only does she have to fear her handlers, but she also fears the law and thus has absolutely nowhere to turn.
Legalizing prostitution isn't about making the market safe or pleasant for johns. Its for the sex workers. I can guarantee that if there was a legal sex worker industry replete with worker protections and perhaps even a union, those workers would have every incentive to help authorities root out sex traffickers.
Legalizing prostitution isn't about making the market safe or pleasant for johns. Its for the sex workers. I can guarantee that if there was a legal sex worker industry replete with worker protections and perhaps even a union, those workers would have every incentive to help authorities root out sex traffickers.
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Mikayla
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NickD: Yes, that is a counter-argument, but in light of what has happened in Amsterdam with its rising level of human trafficking, folks in law enforcement are beginning to see a corellation between legalization and increases of illegal trafficking. And keep in mind, even if the brothels are legal (as they are in Amsterdam) the trafficking is not and legalizing prostitution would not (hopefully) legalize human trafficking - those folks are not going to go "legit" even if prostitution is legalized. Amsterdam is in the process of buying out several notorious problem brothels.
Fluff: The legalization of prostitution will not affect an enslaved woman's ability to appeal to law enforcement - right now those women who are trafficked and who do appeal to law enforcement are not prosecuted for prostitution, but they are deported. That would not change even with legalization. Moreover, the imported/enslaved women have no idea what our laws are, and very little access to information to find out. They are kept tightly controlled by their keepers and most are completely ignorant of the laws of the country to which they have been exported. Indeed, many cannot speak the local language, and most of these women come from countries with extraordinarily corrupt governments and thus are unlikely to take a chance on a government of a country they don't know and whose language they don't speak.
Now, if we didn't deport them .. then they would have an incentive to come to law enforcement - of course, that would result in us allowing in a steady flow of illegal immigrants and that loop hole would soon get taken advantage of also.
Anyway, I agree that legalizing prostitution is for the sex workers, not the Johns or the brothels - and yes, as stated in season 2 of the Wire on exactly this subject "They need a union." They surely do. So, if we were looking at more reforms than just legalization, meaning we were going to legalize AND then ruthlessly attack the brothels with regulation and inspection with the goal of ferreting out traffickers and protecting the women, then I would say "hell yes!" But that sort of total solution is costly and not likely to sell with middle-America with its Judeo-Christian "ethics" and its tendency to villanize prostitutes. But who knows? As Bob Dylan sang, the times they are a changin'.
Fluff: The legalization of prostitution will not affect an enslaved woman's ability to appeal to law enforcement - right now those women who are trafficked and who do appeal to law enforcement are not prosecuted for prostitution, but they are deported. That would not change even with legalization. Moreover, the imported/enslaved women have no idea what our laws are, and very little access to information to find out. They are kept tightly controlled by their keepers and most are completely ignorant of the laws of the country to which they have been exported. Indeed, many cannot speak the local language, and most of these women come from countries with extraordinarily corrupt governments and thus are unlikely to take a chance on a government of a country they don't know and whose language they don't speak.
Now, if we didn't deport them .. then they would have an incentive to come to law enforcement - of course, that would result in us allowing in a steady flow of illegal immigrants and that loop hole would soon get taken advantage of also.
Anyway, I agree that legalizing prostitution is for the sex workers, not the Johns or the brothels - and yes, as stated in season 2 of the Wire on exactly this subject "They need a union." They surely do. So, if we were looking at more reforms than just legalization, meaning we were going to legalize AND then ruthlessly attack the brothels with regulation and inspection with the goal of ferreting out traffickers and protecting the women, then I would say "hell yes!" But that sort of total solution is costly and not likely to sell with middle-America with its Judeo-Christian "ethics" and its tendency to villanize prostitutes. But who knows? As Bob Dylan sang, the times they are a changin'.
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fluffmonster
- Haste Bear
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You basically said that the sex slaves are screwed under either option, in which case their circumstance is immaterial to matter and should not be a factor in the legalization decision. Yes its worth stopping, but it is a separable problem.
In the case of Amsterdam, the correlation between legalization of prostitution and sex trafficking is likely spurrious...there has been more trafficking everywhere, particularly since the fall of the Iron Curtain. Of course, if a causal link between legalization of prostitution and increased incidence of trafficking could be shown, that would indeed sway the case against legalized prostitution.
In the case of Amsterdam, the correlation between legalization of prostitution and sex trafficking is likely spurrious...there has been more trafficking everywhere, particularly since the fall of the Iron Curtain. Of course, if a causal link between legalization of prostitution and increased incidence of trafficking could be shown, that would indeed sway the case against legalized prostitution.
