Oakland Bridge Collapse by terrorists.....

[Jeppan]

Well, I get often the opposite impression. Often certain positions or actions of these advocacy groups do more to hurt their cause then help.

What, exactly, are you refering to? Pridemarches?

[paazin]

Well, I get often the opposite impression. Often certain positions or actions of these advocacy groups do more to hurt their cause then help.

What, exactly, are you refering to? Pridemarches?

Oh, I can't even recall off-hand. All I know is I've seen certain things over the years and thought "Y'know, I'm supportive of your platform and all but that probably is a bad way of getting your point across."

[HATEFACE]

Fox News is so full of bullshit

Try CNN for Bullshit. K, thx.

As for Mik and all the nonsense she and I give each other. I actually like Mik a great deal. Not just for the work she does here, but as a person. I actually respect her a lot for sticking up for what she believes in even if I dont agree with her. I think someone that goes and does what she did to her body has some screws loose, but its her choice to make. As for everything other than our issues about politics, sexual orientation, etc...we would actually probably get along if we met. Im actually a lot different than I am here on the boards and its only when I get fired up about something I truly believe in.

This thread would have been just fine, Mik, if we wouldnt have to have gotten back on this arguement again. It seems no matter what each of us say we go back to same old issues and start in again. Personally, I would prefer Off-topic to just drop all sexual orientation, political, and such issues. It just gets heated and we are all here to actually play a game. Not go at each others throats.

I've calmed down since the other day so have fun with the rest of whatever this thread turns into.

What Danubus is trying to say Mik, is that what he believes what you did to your body is immoral and to some, it could be considered wrong. A lot of people with in the states are opposed to genital multilation a.k.a. alteration. Sexual immorality exists everywhere in the world in how we define and percieve beauty to how we think of each others bodies. As a snide comment, because I'm an arse; It's a wonder you've graduated in the top 10% even though you can't grasp some of the simple concepts of gender stratification. In Somalia and other places, females are often mutilated to remove all sexual feeling. This is considerd to be the norm. Growing you up, you know doubt understood the social outlook of this country toward the choices you have made. You no doubt took the time to consider the reaction of other people's conflicting view points toward your own. Those opposed to you should not be forced to change. Likewise, they shouldn't be able to change you. Doing either would be a conflict of basic freedoms. His right to be an absolute bigot, and your right to pursue inalienable rights to become a "actual citizen" of the united states. Good luck with your fight Mikayla, you're going to need it. I also want to take this time to ask you to reflect upon racism and bigotry with in your own party. It is there and quite apparent. So try to be bipartisan you awful lawyer.

I have no idea about the evolutionary, genetic or whatever aspect of the issue. Either way that does not matter, it is the choice of each and every person who he wants to get frisky with (barring children of course).

Why are people threatened by other peoples sexual preferences? Beats me. I guess they must be so insecure that violence and abuse is the only way out.

Don't bother reading up on genetic evolutionary history on "the issue." At least not for transgendered people, Japanese. You would most likely find it a mental issue. So, okay children are off limits, so we can say that you have some modern day "morality." That's a start, after all pedophilia is considered a mental disease. What about incest? Animals? Objects? Just how far does your percieved morality go? Since you don't advocate sex with children, would it be okay to call you a Pedophobe? or how about a Spartanphobe? I think that sounds cooler.

Miklaya already explained her position on ancient societies revolving around transgendered and homosexuality. The reason people are threatened is obvious. Maybe you fail to grasp the basics. It's understandable why you're so confused Japan. You may ask yourself, Is america oppressive or permissive when it comes to sexual identity and percieved morality. Well, We're not completely oppressive or permissive. Your american hate has blinded you to the obvious truth. We're both. Many believe that sexual conduct is a sign of personal morality (and it is.) Yet our society glorifies sexual encounters when it comes to movies and media. This is the ambigious nature of America. Considering you wont even view "conservative" arguements in your own country. I would consider you to be ignorant. Is that a fair statement?



You can't limit yourself to one program, one party be they republican or democrat. You can't limit yourself to one diametrically opposed view point. That would be the height of ignorance to dismiss even point of views you disagree with. Utimately we don't walk away from these forums any better except to say our own beliefs are bolstered or torn away and the division among republicans and democrats grow. I say it's time we set aside these difference and go after the true enemy. Swedes. Those vikings deserve revenge for the rape and torture of innocent christian monks. They did it for the lulz.

Edit: Will my words be twisted?

[Vendrin]

Helios, I noticed you responded to all of Mikayla's assertions except for where she comments on the job discrimination she has received. Couldn't find a snappy "it's your fault because you are transgender" comment for that could you?

I was never completely comfortable with transgender or homosexual relations, then I met Mikayla, and I changed my opinions cause it's hard to discriminate against someone you actually know.

[Jeppan]

Don't bother reading up on genetic evolutionary history on "the issue." At least not for transgendered people, Japanese. You would most likely find it a mental issue. So, okay children are off limits, so we can say that you have some modern day "morality." That's a start, after all pedophilia is considered a mental disease. What about incest? Animals? Objects? Just how far does your percieved morality go? Since you don't advocate sex with children, would it be okay to call you a Pedophobe? or how about a Spartanphobe? I think that sounds cooler.

Miklaya already explained her position on ancient societies revolving around transgendered and homosexuality. The reason people are threatened is obvious. Maybe you fail to grasp the basics. It's understandable why you're so confused Japan. You may ask yourself, Is america oppressive or permissive when it comes to sexual identity and percieved morality. Well, We're not completely oppressive or permissive. Your american hate has blinded you to the obvious truth. We're both. Many believe that sexual conduct is a sign of personal morality (and it is.) Yet our society glorifies sexual encounters when it comes to movies and media. This is the ambigious nature of America. Considering you wont even view "conservative" arguements in your own country. I would consider you to be ignorant. Is that a fair statement?

It does not surprise me one bit that you got strung up on the kiddie-sex. You seem like the type.

That said, of course morals are not timeless, what we percieve today will be considered biggoted in the future perhaps. Such is life but that does not excuse discriminating against those who are different from the norm, especially not state-sponsored discrimination (which is the case of the US and many other countries, probably Sweden too if you look close enough).

Yes the US is something of a dual nature. Modern liberal along the coasts and pitch-dark conservative inland (an exageration but still somewhat true). Your argument does not hold water however. How does explicit nakedness in movies help transgendered people in their struggle for equal rights? Having a dual-nature does not excuse treating some people more equal than others.

Maybe you should leave your little shack in Hicksville USA and come see the world. It would do you good to get some perspective on things, other than the occasional firebrand sermon on the coming of Christ and the odd article about motorcycles in "Big´uns".

[Jeppan]

Well, I get often the opposite impression. Often certain positions or actions of these advocacy groups do more to hurt their cause then help.

What, exactly, are you refering to? Pridemarches?

Oh, I can't even recall off-hand. All I know is I've seen certain things over the years and thought "Y'know, I'm supportive of your platform and all but that probably is a bad way of getting your point across."

That can be said about just about every faction, political group, lobbyist group or whatever in all the world.

Funnily enough that argument/viewpoint is only used, at least to my knowledge here in Sweden, when feminist, animal righrs activists, enviromentalist or homosexuals demands their rights. What that means I am not enterily sure but I would not lay the blame on the activists alone.

[Mikayla]

Helios:

Good, you're allowed to serve. Granted it's not openly but does that matter in the military? I'm glad you provided a service to our country.
I don't know if you actually regret doing it or not.

Yes it matters. One person I know who got outed in the military was beaten up and hung from a third-floor barracks window. Fortunately he survived. His attackers were never caught, but he was dishonorably discharged for being gay.

Helios:

The state can't dictate religion to change it's laws and should remain that way. Marriage will always be defined by a man and a woman by religious mandate, unless you happen to find a religion that doesn't do this, and there are some out there. Find some sort of strange neo-hinduism, that would kickass.

I have never asked nor argued for religions to change their view - only the government. I believe the best over all solution is to eradicate "marriage" from the laws of the country and make all laws dealing with "marriage" deal with civil unions instead, so all folks are on equal footing. Then the churches can do what they will with "marriage." I only get upset when the churches view of what is marriage defines my secular rights. Danubus, for example, has every right to believe what he wishes - but - his religious beliefs should not define my secular, legal rights. His religion should not dictate how OUR government treats me.

As for what I did to my body ... hmm ... let me address this very personally.

Dan, you are an epileptic, yes? And you treat your condition with medication, yes? Now, is treating your condition immoral? Did not God make you epileptic? If God made you epileptic, is not immoral to try and undue His work?

Of course not. Epilepsy is the challenge that God gave you, and how you handle it is one of the things that will define your character. And what have you done? Have you given up? Have you killed yourself or gone wild with rage over this affliction you suffer? No. You've gotten treatment and now you do the best you can.

And thats the same with me. I did not ask to be transgender anymore than you asked to be epileptic, I was just born that way. Being transgender is the challenge God has given me - the only choice I have in the matter is what I am going to do about it. Am I going to refuse treatment, and go on pretending to be a man and in so doing make my life and my loved one's lives miserable and false? Shall I continue to live a lie? Or . . . will I admit what I am challenged with? Will I face up to my challenge with courage, will I look it in the face and deal it with honestly and seek treatment?

Yes. And that is exactly what I did. Years ago I was in a failing marriage, I was miserable, my loved ones were miserable and I was living a lie. Then I got the courage to face my challenge - I sought help. I was diagnosed with Gender Identity Disorder and I then did the only thing you can do to cure Gender Identity Disorder - I got my body and mind in sync - for me that meant transitioning. Now I am happy, my personal life has come together, and I don't go to bed praying to God to change me into a girl - because its been done. My therapist says I no longer have Gender Identity Disorder anymore, and so I no longer go to therapy.

I met the challenge - case closed.

And Helios, comparing what I voluntarily do to my body to the forced genital mutilation that occurs in some countries is ridiculous and offensive.

As for my "party" and racism and bigotry - I actually deal with those issues day in and day out in a real fashion as President of San Francisco Pride. If you have doubts, ask the queer communities of color in San Francisco. This is not something I address solely with rhetoric on an internet gaming chat board - racism and bigotry are things I actually get out in the world and DO something about.

[HATEFACE]

Helios, I noticed you responded to all of Mikayla's assertions except for where she comments on the job discrimination she has received. Couldn't find a snappy "it's your fault because you are transgender" comment for that could you?

I was never completely comfortable with transgender or homosexual relations, then I met Mikayla, and I changed my opinions cause it's hard to discriminate against someone you actually know.

It appears I struck a democratic cord with you, Vendrin. I never mentioned anything about it being her fault. She may very well have faced and experienced job discrimination, or she may have been let go for other reasons. I “DONT” know. I could comment because of what I do know of her but according to your liberal mindset, making assumptions about a person is bad. Thus, in effort to save you the whining droll of how bigoted and sexist I am, I wont. It probably won't be okay with you and you'll say I'm avoiding.

Your additude is poopy, and may transfer to me so forgive me if I totally become an asshole to you. I wonder if it was in anyway caused by me or my prior posts. Maybe you just had a bad day. No worries mate.

However, I can state that “inequality” happens to us all irregardless of our sexual affiliation. Indeed affirmative action/reverse racism, racism, sexism is a fundamental flaw which needs to be corrected in our society. It could potentially be abolished by blind liberalism and I fear that day. But you blindly follow and you have no idea why I would fear it. I'll allow you to poke around in the dark without explaining myself.

It isn't my problem that you can't discern asshattery nature from my true point of view. Such is the mindset of the modern day liberal with their inability to discern truth from fiction, morality from immorality, and good and evil. Such lines are ultimately blurred from your party and turned into and endless areas of gray. Do you see the world as complicated? I could agree with you and say that it is complicated, or. . .(I'm leaving this for your assumption of what you may think I'm about to say. If you don't fill in the blank, I'll just know that you are completely clueless.) I don't have to be purposefully ignorant to the point of being flawed. It's the reason why Saddam is supported as good and George Bush called down for being a war monger. Don't believe me? Try looking for yourself.

Now, before you go on the "You're a douche-bag blind George Bush supporter." KNOW and ACCEPT that I have issues with the failed policies in Iraq and with every single "obvious" lie that I have spouted on this forum I've left a thread of truth for those with stable minds to follow.

You have been indoctrinated well, but not fully. There are conservative view points you in yet, Vendrin. Keep typing and I'll rip them from you.
Since you appear to be more sensible then others here, I may feel it is my duty to correct you. So be on guard for that if you don't want to change.

I'm sorry that you were originally a bigoted homophobe like me Buu hoo!
I try to change I try!! - But I'm a jerk and thus must feel like I should discriminate against those Muslims that are talking bad about America while praying upon the plane to the District of Columbia, as an example.

. . .and you are right it's hard to discriminate against those that you know, BECAUSE you know them. Pretty obvious right? I'm not going to worry if you're stumped, you'll just take this post out of context to prove a point. That's all you can do. . .

Watch me make assumptions about Jeppan.
He's an atheist or agnostic. Am I right? Jeppan, feel like chiming in?

It does not surprise me one bit that you got strung up on the kiddie-sex. You seem like the type.

That said, of course morals are not timeless, what we percieve today will be considered biggoted in the future perhaps. Such is life but that does not excuse discriminating against those who are different from the norm, especially not state-sponsored discrimination (which is the case of the US and many other countries, probably Sweden too if you look close enough).

Yes the US is something of a dual nature. Modern liberal along the coasts and pitch-dark conservative inland (an exageration but still somewhat true). Your argument does not hold water however. How does explicit nakedness in movies help transgendered people in their struggle for equal rights? Having a dual-nature does not excuse treating some people more equal than others.

Maybe you should leave your little shack in Hicksville USA and come see the world. It would do you good to get some perspective on things, other than the occasional firebrand sermon on the coming of Christ and the odd article about motorcycles in "Big´uns".

You know I'm not strung up on kiddie sex and I just proved a point. You feel threatened. I understand.

I'm glad you agree morals are not timeless. But do you consider good and evil to be timeless? In other words, can we look back on our long history of humanity o' wise Jeppan, and see that there have been moments of good verses evil?

Now Japanese, I'm not advocating state-sponsored discrimination. I'm advocating independent discrimination. I understand the morality behind it, and I'm not arguing this to defend holier then thou art Danubus. My question is, do you understand the morality behind it?

Thank you for saying US is “something” of a dual nature. I just want to confirm the fact that it “IS” a dual nature. Modern “Neo”-liberal along the coasts and “pitch-dark” conservatives southernly inland. A blatant exaggeration to be sure and not entirely true.

Again your confusion is obvious. I was in no way aiding trans-gendered people's “equal rights” by pointing out the duality with in the united states.

Having a dual-nature does not excuse treating some people more equal than others.

I'm afraid you are completely wrong there Japan. If you mean the state has no right treating some more equal then others you're right. However, we both know you meant individuals. I'm afraid equality doesn't exist, not until it's eliminated through abstract blind liberalism, which you seem to whole heartily practice, or eliminated through conservative moral rights, which, I'm afraid to say, doesn't include our friend Danubus at all. . .

Maybe you should leave your little shack in Hicksville USA and come see the world. It would do you good to get some perspective on things, other than the occasional firebrand sermon on the coming of Christ and the odd article about motorcycles in "Big´uns".

This is a self-defeating argument. Response N/A.

Helios:
Quote:
Good, you're allowed to serve. Granted it's not openly but does that matter in the military? I'm glad you provided a service to our country.
I don't know if you actually regret doing it or not.


Yes it matters. One person I know who got outed in the military was beaten up and hung from a third-floor barracks window. Fortunately he survived. His attackers were never caught, but he was dishonorably discharged for being gay.

That sounds bad. Can't you challenge the ruling of the military court?

And Helios, comparing what I voluntarily do to my body to the forced genital mutilation that occurs in some countries is ridiculous and offensive.

As for my "party" and racism and bigotry - I actually deal with those issues day in and day out in a real fashion as President of San Francisco Pride. If you have doubts, ask the queer communities of color in San Francisco. This is not something I address solely with rhetoric on an internet gaming chat board - racism and bigotry are things I actually get out in the world and DO something about.

Well, I'm glad you believe mentally okay. I hardly describe you as stable, as you would no doubt consider me mentally unstable. It's an eye for an eye sort of thing. I hope you understand.

Well Mikayla, you certainly do seem to think genital multilation is forced and not local custom. Allow me to fix your confusion by telling you it is considered a social custom. Though - condemned by moderate Muslim clergy and often dismissed "Oh it's their culture, mutilation is fine by me. Let's just call it vagina cutting." liberals. It is still practiced to this day and I for one find it morally wrong. Does this "culture" shock you that it's practiced? It certainly attracts the anmesty international crowd.

Now, are you implying that I don't do anything aside from gripe on a gaming forum? Oh, poor mislead Mikayla. (lol, it reaks of condescension doesn't it? I suppose it depends on your point of view.) We have different views. You're a liberal who will eventually fall in line with the other liberal "queer" folk, I don't know if that's the appropriate terminology, I hope it is, but if it isn't I honestly don't givashit.

Now, I think you do a fine job as "president" of your "queer" community to help show Danubus the errors of his beliefs and allow him time to become more moderate. You don't fight extreamism with more in the same. (Please don't allude to the iraq war.) Shouldn't it be your responsibility as a "president" to make better understand?

I'm glad you get out there and "DO" something about it. I don't do anything. I prefer to sit on my arse and bitch in a private gaming forum on some random nwn community. This is what I do. This is ALL I do. Please feel free to judge me and call me evil for being a conservative and advocating (I prefer the word understanding instead of advocating. But you liberals, I love how your minds work.) hate speach. Mikyala, I've always doubted you and it will never change until you do. (What? Change how? What does he mean by that? **Bites finger nails.** It must be some sort of homophobic quip?!)

[Swift]

Your additude is poopy, and may transfer to me so forgive me if I totally become an a**hole to you. I wonder if it was in anyway caused by me or my prior posts. Maybe you just had a bad day. No worries mate.

No apology needed, you seem to have been an asshole to pretty much everyone in this thread so far, i doubt anyone will blink an eye when you become an asshole to Vendrin.

[HATEFACE]

Your additude is poopy, and may transfer to me so forgive me if I totally become an a**hole to you. I wonder if it was in anyway caused by me or my prior posts. Maybe you just had a bad day. No worries mate.

No apology needed, you seem to have been an a**hole to pretty much everyone in this thread so far, i doubt anyone will blink an eye when you become an a**hole to Vendrin.

Great, let me know if I stray to far from being a complete jerk to you as well. United in ALFA we stand. In God we Trust.

[NickD]

Have you [...] gone wild with rage over this affliction you suffer? No.

Debatable.

Mik, I've wondered about this in the past, but never got around to asking... As a transgendered woman, what is your gender legally in the US? (i.e., if you were to get married, would you have to marry a man or a woman?)

[HATEFACE]

Have you [...] gone wild with rage over this affliction you suffer? No.

Debatable, cause I'm an ass. I'm NickD and I'm a completely intolerant, "tolerant" liberal undedumechated njubs'ead.

Mik, I've wondered about this in the past, but never got around to asking... As a transgendered woman, what is your gender legally in the US? (i.e., if you were to get married, would you have to marry a man or a woman?)

NickD, haven't you read the prior posts? She isn't legally supported by our evil government. She has no gender. She has to check the other box. Though legally one, can speculate that she has to check Male considering that is her natural born gender despite any mental instability to the contrary.

Mikyala once told me a brief bit about herself (yeah brief, from her. I know. ) and she mentioned that she can technically go with both genders. So what I gathered is that it's ambigious.

[Mikayla]

NickD: It depends on what state of the country I am in. In California, I am legally female so I can marry a male. In Texas and a few other states, I am considered legally male, so I can marry a female - yes, oddly enough, Texas will allow me to have a "legal" lesbian marriage so long as the other girl is genetically female.

Helios: The genital mutilation of which you speak is not particularly familiar to me and its not the issue - its just more obfuscation on your part in an attempt to paint a black picture of people you are in debate with.

Helios

Now, I think you do a fine job as "president" of your "queer" community to help show Danubus the errors of his beliefs and allow him time to become more moderate. You don't fight extreamism with more in the same. (Please don't allude to the iraq war.) Shouldn't it be your responsibility as a "president" to make better understand?

"To make better understand"? What does that mean? Anyway, yes, education is one of the goals of my organization - its in our mission statement - and I do it, a lot. I've been in two Discovery Channel documentaries, I go to law schools and speak on trans and trans law issues, I help teach classes to lawyers on the same, I appear in the media in a variety of ways, I've authored a brochure from the California State Bar on Transgender rights, I've . . . I've done and am doing a lot.

As for extremism - what extremism? I ask to be given the same rights as any other, non-trans, non-gay American. If thats "extremism" is the same kind of "extremism" preached by the leaders of the civil rights movement in the 60s, the women's suffrage movement at the turn of the century, and the anti-slaver abolitionists before them. If desiring to be treated fairly is extremist - then so be it.

But of course - its not extreme to wish to be treated fairly, its only natural.

Helios:

I don't do anything. I prefer to sit on my arse and b*tch in a private gaming forum on some random nwn community. This is what I do. This is ALL I do. Please feel free to judge me and call me evil for being a conservative and advocating (I prefer the word understanding instead of advocating. But you liberals, I love how your minds work.) hate speach.

Evil? No, not evil. In the real world the vast majority of people are not evil, some of them just do evil - but that implies doing something. And you don't do anything.

Indeed, I suspect that is your problem - it is my assumption that you are a straight appearing white male, and as such I believe you have a sense of entitlement. But you are either lazy or afraid and you've done nothing with your life to this point. So you look around and if you see straight white males ahead of you in the socio-economic pyramid, well, thats ok, because they are "entitled", like you, but when you see non-straight, non-males ahead of you in that pyramid, people who get more respect than you, well, that makes you mad because you know that they have more obstacles in their path than you do and yet, they've gotten further.

But for all this, you've only yourself to blame, and deep inside, you know it. And it makes you mad - and so you take it out on the others around you, which, since you don't get out, is us in ALFA. And yourself - your self-deprecating posts above give evidence to it.

There is a simple solution you know. Get out of ALFA chat, get off the forums, and go live your life and make it what you want it to be. You'll be happier. I know - its what I did. I went out and I made my life what I want it to be, and now, I am much happier than I was. Don't waste your life hating others - make your life worth living.

[HATEFACE]

NickD: It depends on what state of the country I am in. In California, I am legally female so I can marry a male. In Texas and a few other states, I am considered legally male, so I can marry a female - yes, oddly enough, Texas will allow me to have a "legal" lesbian marriage so long as the other girl is genetically female.

Helios: The genital mutilation of which you speak is not particularly familiar to me and its not the issue - its just more obfuscation on your part in an attempt to paint a black picture of people you are in debate with.

It is “related” to the issue of sexual normalcy in societies. You're attempting to cloud the issue and dismiss the true intention of my post.

Helios

Now, I think you do a fine job as "president" of your "queer" community to help show Danubus the errors of his beliefs and allow him time to become more moderate. You don't fight extreamism with more in the same. (Please don't allude to the iraq war.) Shouldn't it be your responsibility as a "president" to make better understand?

. . .to make him better understand. Sorry, one word missing. Somehow knew you would jump all over it.

"To make better understand"? What does that mean? Anyway, yes, education is one of the goals of my organization - its in our mission statement - and I do it, a lot. I've been in two Discovery Channel documentaries, I go to law schools and speak on trans and trans law issues, I help teach classes to lawyers on the same, I appear in the media in a variety of ways, I've authored a brochure from the California State Bar on Transgender rights, I've . . . I've done and am doing a lot.

Yes, you've done a lot. You wouldn't mind if I give you some constructive criticism too would you? What would you say to Danubus to reach a common ground? I don't doubt your ability to argue a position. You do it quite well as a lawyer. My concern is your ability to moderate two opposing positions. My point being, is that you obliterate rather then placate. You know the major religion in America and thus know the majority of people's beliefs yet you jump on people as if you're in a court room. You're doing it to me now and you've done it to me in the past. If anyone is vulnerable here, it's you. I understand your position. You're only defending your position. What do you believe Danubus is doing? Take it from me, I know. Religion isn't something to argue against. It's next to impossible because of narrow-minded nature of it. It can only be defeated through understanding which you are completely incapable of. Placate to his position, try reading some bible verses or something.

As for extremism - what extremism? I ask to be given the same rights as any other, non-trans, non-gay American. If thats "extremism" is the same kind of "extremism" preached by the leaders of the civil rights movement in the 60s, the women's suffrage movement at the turn of the century, and the anti-slaver abolitionists before them. If desiring to be treated fairly is extremist - then so be it.

So Danubus isn't extreme? Your rights are being limited, but not all of them. Seeing yourself as the victim and fully oppressed by the state makes you appear a tad extreme by some. If you want to gather your group and riot, then go ahead. Civil strife is another way to bring about change.

But of course - its not extreme to wish to be treated fairly, its only natural.

I agree with that.

Helios:

I don't do anything. I prefer to sit on my arse and b*tch in a private gaming forum on some random nwn community. This is what I do. This is ALL I do. Please feel free to judge me and call me evil for being a conservative and advocating (I prefer the word understanding instead of advocating. But you liberals, I love how your minds work.) hate speech.

Evil? No, not evil. In the real world the vast majority of people are not evil, some of them just do evil - but that implies doing something. And you don't do anything.

HELLO YOU ARE WRONG. "In the real world," nice use there Mikayla. Everything is a battle with you and I feel sorry that you're always on the offensive. The vast majority of the people are not evil, you're correct, but evil does exist. You're attempting to obscure the importance of morality by focusing on me. Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you're immoral in anyway. I'm just saying you're using liberalism to justify your position on equal rights and the only reason the democratic party will listen to you is because they will agree with anything and there is no moral standard there. I wonder what would happen if the trans-gender movement was suddenly republican and conservative. Would they change their minds? Probably and eventually but it would take some doing on your part, way more then if you attempt to negotiate with democrats.

You can't say we're evil, because you have family members that are probably republicans. You can't say we're stupid because let's face it, there are very smart, well informed, successful republicans.

So what are we Mikayla?

Indeed, I suspect that is your problem - it is my assumption that you are a straight appearing white male, and as such I believe you have a sense of entitlement. But you are either lazy or afraid and you've done nothing with your life to this point. So you look around and if you see straight white males ahead of you in the socio-economic pyramid, well, thats ok, because they are "entitled", like you, but when you see non-straight, non-males ahead of you in that pyramid, people who get more respect than you, well, that makes you mad because you know that they have more obstacles in their path than you do and yet, they've gotten further.

But for all this, you've only yourself to blame, and deep inside, you know it. And it makes you mad - and so you take it out on the others around you, which, since you don't get out, is us in ALFA. And yourself - your self-deprecating posts above give evidence to it.

There is a simple solution you know. Get out of ALFA chat, get off the forums, and go live your life and make it what you want it to be. You'll be happier. I know - its what I did. I went out and I made my life what I want it to be, and now, I am much happier than I was. Don't waste your life hating others - make your life worth living.

Um, thanks for the “constructive” criticism and suggestions. I'll try to ply it to my daily life. I. . I guess I should leave ALFA. All I wanted was to be treated fairly by this community but I guess I have to go. It is what you want after all, Mikyala. This is the same type of mental anguish I took from my parents. I suppose you don't know anything about that. They said I would never make anything of myself and they were right. I can't help it if I was abused by my dad and I'm now a shut in. I don't know how to improve myself, I don't even know where to start. I'm so far below the socio-economic pyramid I don't even touch the base. I reach out on the irc often speaking with myself late at night when no one is around for company. I'm so lonely . . . What am I going to do Mikayla? Can you give me some advice? Sometimes my questions feel cherrypicked.

Okay that's total bullshit. You're entitled to your opinion Mikyala.
and it's in my own opinion, Mikayla. That you are smart, wise, haughty, narcissistic, cruel, "edit" and forgot elitist. I just want you to know that despite everything you've said, you've not changed my mind about you and your mind has not been changed about me. Everything has come full circle. Is this a fair assessment to make?

You may ask, what does it matter what one random person on NWN thinks? What difference does it make?

Mulu advocates talking with your “enemy” in an attempt to meet a common ground. What good does it do when neither side is willing to give?

Social liberals believe that war can be abolished. I don't know if it can, but it's better to go the true conservative route. (I sense snide comments on the horizon.) None, NOT ONE of you liberals truely know what that is.

May I ask how you would all intend to abolish war?

[Jeppan]

Watch me make assumptions about Jeppan.
He's an atheist or agnostic. Am I right? Jeppan, feel like chiming in?

Depending on the day really but I guess agnostic would be a just label. I am anti-clergy though and I am not part of any church (any longer) as so far I have not found that suit me both as a believer and a sentient person.

You know I'm not strung up on kiddie sex and I just proved a point. You feel threatened. I understand.

Threatened? Not really. Mad as hell for people taking advantage of children for their own twisted needs? You bet. I can understand the philosophical nature of the question, that it is one sexual preference over another but that does not make it one bit less wrong in practice.

I'm glad you agree morals are not timeless. But do you consider good and evil to be timeless?

As far as I see it there is no good and evil, it is all about who is looking. Then of course there are people who can arguably be called evil but they all have been on the losers side of a conflict so it is hard to tell really. As general rule I do not believe in that kind of over-simplification, it is for Hollywood Movies, and not for real life.

Now Japanese, I'm not advocating state-sponsored discrimination. I'm advocating independent discrimination. I understand the morality behind it, and I'm not arguing this to defend holier then thou art Danubus. My question is, do you understand the morality behind it?

Yes, not that I would advocate any kind of discrimination but if I had to chose I would prefer the state to treat everyone equal and go from there. Maybe peoples views would change with new legislation as well?

I'm afraid you are completely wrong there Japan. If you mean the state has no right treating some more equal then others you're right. However, we both know you meant individuals. I'm afraid equality doesn't exist, not until it's eliminated through abstract blind liberalism, which you seem to whole heartily practice, or eliminated through conservative moral rights, which, I'm afraid to say, doesn't include our friend Danubus at all. . .

Blind liberalism? Who has been advocating that? Just because you are not laissez-fair-damn-everything-liberal does not mean you cannot avoid state discrimination. I am far from a neo-liberal mind you, rather a social-liberal (I am actually politically active in the socialdemocrat party in Sweden)