VPILF

Veilan · Post by **Veilan** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 12:58 pm

I think the basis is that when they say "elitist", they don't mean "elite", but arrogant-snob-sneering-down-on-you / ivory-tower-egg-head-without-common-sense.

Kest · Post by **Kest** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 1:03 pm

Veilan · Post by **Veilan** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 1:23 pm

That pic looks more like he's checking out the booty

.

And as we know from Bill Clinton, nothing endears you more to the common folk than screwing ugly chicks

.

danielmn · Post by **danielmn** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 1:47 pm

Yeah...lie about personal sexual relations and get impeached....cause the personal life is our business, who cares how well you run the country...

Start a false war with artificial information and ignore the facts and get....

a cookie?

Mulu · Post by **Mulu** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 4:26 pm

danielmn wrote:Yeah...lie about personal sexual relations and get impeached....cause the personal life is our business, who cares how well you run the country...

Start a false war with artificial information and ignore the facts and get....

a cookie?

Get re-elected....

Mulu · Post by **Mulu** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 4:28 pm

Veilan wrote:I think the basis is that when they say "elitist", they don't mean "elite", but arrogant-snob-sneering-down-on-you / ivory-tower-egg-head-without-common-sense.

That's certainly the way some gamers mean it when talking about this place.

ç i p h é r · Post by **ç i p h é r** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 7:14 pm

Mayhem wrote:For example, somebody that studied (and lectured in) Constitutional Law, rather than somebody whose primary selling point (judging only by the number of times they themselves remind us of the fact) is that they were a POW.

Not quite. More like a man who has dedicated his life to his country and who embodies service, patriotism, duty, honor. It's interesting though that you would place study over sacrifice. I think most Americans would say that sacrifice was the greater of the two; it's much harder to be self-less than self-indulgent. Who among us, after all, would trade 5 years of college for 5 years of torture?

But Veilan's explanation is exactly right. It's not about being good at what you do - clearly we want that in our president - but rather about looking down your nose at people - clearly we don't want that in our president.

Veilan · Post by **Veilan** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 7:19 pm

Mulu wrote:
Veilan wrote:I think the basis is that when they say "elitist", they don't mean "elite", but arrogant-snob-sneering-down-on-you / ivory-tower-egg-head-without-common-sense.
That's certainly the way some gamers mean it when talking about this place.

Bah, I can only look down on those folks. *sneers*

Mayhem · Post by **Mayhem** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 8:32 pm

ç i p h é r wrote:
Mayhem wrote:For example, somebody that studied (and lectured in) Constitutional Law, rather than somebody whose primary selling point (judging only by the number of times they themselves remind us of the fact) is that they were a POW.
Not quite. More like a man who has dedicated his life to his country and who embodies service, patriotism, duty, honor. It's interesting though that you would place study over sacrifice. I think most Americans would say that sacrifice was the greater of the two; it's much harder to be self-less than self-indulgent. Who among us, after all, would trade 5 years of college for 5 years of torture?

Eh, maybe if he'd been an Elite pilot he wouldn't have crashed...

Mulu · Post by **Mulu** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 8:32 pm

ç i p h é r wrote:Not quite. More like a man who has dedicated his life to his country and who embodies service, patriotism, duty, honor.

But how does that make you qualified to understand and forge proper policy regarding stem cell research, or global warming, or healthcare? You can be blindingly patriotic and not be able to tie your shoes. I don't want my President to be mindlessly dutiful and love America like a small child loves its parents, without any real comprehension or questioning, and you shouldn't either.

Besides, there is nothing honorable about his current hatespeech campaign. He flushed his honor down the toilet.

sgould72 · Post by **sgould72** » Mon Oct 13, 2008 11:58 pm

Considering how McCain's campaign has been conducted, I really don't see how anyone could call him the "embodiment of honor" with anything resembling a straight face.

ç i p h é r · Post by **ç i p h é r** » Tue Oct 14, 2008 12:42 am

Mulu wrote:But how does that make you qualified to understand and forge proper policy regarding stem cell research, or global warming, or healthcare? You can be blindingly patriotic and not be able to tie your shoes. I don't want my President to be mindlessly dutiful and love America like a small child loves its parents, without any real comprehension or questioning, and you shouldn't either.

It doesn't, but 20 some years serving as a legislator certainly should.

Mulu wrote:Besides, there is nothing honorable about his current hatespeech campaign. He flushed his honor down the toilet.

What hate speech?

There's a lot of shit flying around, that's true. But let's be perfectly honest. Neither McCain nor Obama have complete control over the political process. Remember, Obama was the guy who was going to change the political dialog, but he too has entered the wrestling arena like all the others partly to defend himself and partly because he has to to win....it's a grinder and folks on either side (like Begala and Coulter) encourage it, seeming to think that at the end of that process, the strongest candidate emerges. I dunno. Maybe at the end of that process, you just end up with sausage.

Veilan · Post by **Veilan** » Tue Oct 14, 2008 1:11 am

Jesting aside for a bit, I am severely disappointed. In my opinion, this whole election and the tactics used were John McCain diminishing himself.

I've stated before that my preference was Hillary, McCain, Obama, but by now, that's no longer true.

I know he was under so much pressure to "turn around" the election, but the way he went is still - and rightfully so - costing him it. Had he campaigned in a fashion truly in line with the principles that seem to have driven his prior life, he probably still wouldn't have won - but he'd have given his country a lot more.

McCain to me seems uncomfortable and uneasy, his campaign in the hands of people that are just not his style, at times desperate and confused. His tries at populism seemed whack, and honestly, a year ago, I'd have thought a man of McCain's stature would have thrown out someone shouting "Terrorist!" after asking who the "real Obama" is. Today, he just has a stupid grin.

He seems lessened, and I do not say that with the glee or foregone conclusion of attitudes that you'd get from a democrat. I really rooted for the guy before (not that it matters), and I'm disappointed.

I'm still not really in the Obama boat, but by now I do believe it probably would be better if he won.

Kest · Post by **Kest** » Tue Oct 14, 2008 1:18 am

Veilan wrote:He seems lessened, and I do not say that with the glee or foregone conclusion of attitudes that you'd get from a democrat. I really rooted for the guy before (not that it matters), and I'm disappointed.

Early in the year I was for Obama over Hillary and McCain over Huckabee/Romney. He makes me embarrassed to admit that, now.

Mulu · Post by **Mulu** » Tue Oct 14, 2008 2:40 am

ç i p h é r wrote: But let's be perfectly honest. Neither McCain nor Obama have complete control over the political process.

But they do have control over their campaigns, including the ads they run and the rhetoric they use. Claiming Obama pals around with terrorists is more than just false, it's dangerous. Some right-wing whacko will attempt the obvious because of it, making the job of those duty and honor bound Secret Service Agents a lot harder. McCain's campaign sins are unforgivable. If he wants to lie about Obama raising taxes, fine. That's standard political rhetoric. He crossed the line, and he knows it since he's started backpedaling, though only tepidly. He still wants to win, at any cost.