Actually, it was those supportive of planetouched that classified themselves that way. Though I also think you can't really draw clear lines - I'm sure those who voted no see the merits and drawbacks just like those who voted yet, but just weighed the points differently.
I also agree that this should not be stylized into any "us vs. them", and that we need to realize we all are in the same house. ALFA is a community, and we should be mature enough to accept decisions don't always end up how we like them to be and move on. I favour the Rotku suggestion too (hey, it's a compromise), but so what? I also favoured a lot of things and have also seen my share of unjust decisions, you contest them once through the instances and means that are available to you, then shrug, move on, and do your job.
Dropping Out of the Race
Moderator: ALFA Administrators
Last edited by Veilan on Wed Nov 21, 2007 8:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The power of concealment lies in revelation.
Sorry FI, didn't mean it like that. You voted yes afterall. 
One has to admit that there is a very X vs. Y attitude prevalent instead of a X and Y reaching Z.
It seems that it's either one way or the otherway. That leads to conflict. It was just an observation from the outside, not a target at you whatsoever.
Sorry again for the misunderstanding.
One has to admit that there is a very X vs. Y attitude prevalent instead of a X and Y reaching Z.
It seems that it's either one way or the otherway. That leads to conflict. It was just an observation from the outside, not a target at you whatsoever.
Sorry again for the misunderstanding.
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FanaticusIncendi
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- Joined: Sun Dec 19, 2004 9:58 am
- Location: Exile
Many people in ALFA bicker, and telling them to play nice isn't going to change that. I know, I tried that tactic already.
My point about the formalized process is that it would cut down dramatically on the pointless bickering we often see manifesting around these types of issues. Just look at all the bickering the planetouched issue has caused, both now and all the other times it gets brought up and argued about. If there was a formalized, documented process with a time limit on a final admin decision what we would have instead would be a flurry of argument, then a decision that stands, thus eliminating the need for people to continue to poke at it. If it can't be resurrected there's no need to poke at it, just to bury it.
My point about the formalized process is that it would cut down dramatically on the pointless bickering we often see manifesting around these types of issues. Just look at all the bickering the planetouched issue has caused, both now and all the other times it gets brought up and argued about. If there was a formalized, documented process with a time limit on a final admin decision what we would have instead would be a flurry of argument, then a decision that stands, thus eliminating the need for people to continue to poke at it. If it can't be resurrected there's no need to poke at it, just to bury it.
Currently otherwise occupied.
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JaydeMoon
- Fionn In Disguise
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- Contact:
We could have dead horse week!
A week where all dead horse topics are quickly revisited, debated over, and revoted on!
And outside of that week, those topics are taboo!
Any volatile topic that gets decided on gets put in the dead horse list!
This way people don't have to feel hopeless that their pet issue will never come up again. A wonderful compromise between settling an issue and having the chance to bring it before the board again.
Dead horse week would be AWESOME!!!
A week where all dead horse topics are quickly revisited, debated over, and revoted on!
And outside of that week, those topics are taboo!
Any volatile topic that gets decided on gets put in the dead horse list!
This way people don't have to feel hopeless that their pet issue will never come up again. A wonderful compromise between settling an issue and having the chance to bring it before the board again.
Dead horse week would be AWESOME!!!
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FanaticusIncendi
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- Joined: Sun Dec 19, 2004 9:58 am
- Location: Exile
But seriously, I will quit if I see your Fey'ri-Deva Vampire....
Either that or make a Assimar Bruce Lee Werewolf and kick your butt!
Either that or make a Assimar Bruce Lee Werewolf and kick your butt!
Zyrus Meynolt: [Party] For the record, if this somehow blows up in our faces and I die, I want a raiseSwift wrote: Permadeath is only permadeath when the PCs wallet is empty.
<Castano>: danielnm - can you blame them?
<danielmn>: Yes,
<danielmn>: Easily.
"And in this twilight....our choices seal our fate"
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Mikayla
- Valsharess of ALFA
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- Location: Qu'ellar Faen Tlabbar, Noble Room 7, Menzoberranzan, NorthUnderdark
Does this mean my half-fiend, vampiric, force-using Nightsister drow is going to be a problem?
Last edited by Mikayla on Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
ALFA1-NWN1: Sheyreiza Valakahsa
NWN2: Layla (aka Aliyah, Amira, Snake and others) and Vellya
NWN1-WD: Shein'n Valakasha
NWN2: Layla (aka Aliyah, Amira, Snake and others) and Vellya
NWN1-WD: Shein'n Valakasha
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psycho_leo
- Rust Monster
- Posts: 1162
- Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 2:10 am
- Location: Brazil
Zyrus Meynolt: [Party] For the record, if this somehow blows up in our faces and I die, I want a raiseSwift wrote: Permadeath is only permadeath when the PCs wallet is empty.
<Castano>: danielnm - can you blame them?
<danielmn>: Yes,
<danielmn>: Easily.
"And in this twilight....our choices seal our fate"
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FanaticusIncendi
- Illithid
- Posts: 1725
- Joined: Sun Dec 19, 2004 9:58 am
- Location: Exile
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psycho_leo
- Rust Monster
- Posts: 1162
- Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 2:10 am
- Location: Brazil
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fluffmonster
- Haste Bear
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- Location: Wisconsin, USA
ALFA... the greatest social experiment of the 21st century.
Anyway, a "formal process", which I think is utterly retarded in a gaming community, beyond yes/no, won't change a thing. As long as you have the silly system of re-electing admin every 6 months or whatever it is now, things will change. Things that stood before have changed. And things that stand now will change in the future. Y'all forget... the previous admin (Fluff and co.), as well as the admin that were in when I was lead (when NWN2 was out and I was in the beta test) all stated that Planetouched were in. But, the current admin, for some reason, decided to hold another vote and now they're out. A formal decision process will not make a bit of difference. If an incoming admin or a sitting admin wishes to change somethin' they don't like, or think serves the community better, they will or will damn sure try. It's inherent in a system like this. You take a 100 people and tell them to write a story with the same plot and same characters, you get 100 different stories. You keep re-electing different admin, you get a different way of thinkin' on ALFA's "direction".
That is the sad truth. As long as this system is in place, I don't care what you formalize. You can't have one admin change somethin' then tell the next admin not to touch it. Hell, if I were the new lead I'd change the planetouched decision simply because ALFA didn't even bother to test out planetouched real world before deciding they weren't in. And most of the decisions were based on ignorance or dislike of the races, not on what their actual in-game effect would be.
Why have formal processes when you could simply have a group of 5-7 admin with no domains who just make decisions, and do the stuff it takes to make the community, and gameworld run so that everybody has fun? Too straightforward, huh?
Why try and put every little, niggling item to a vote/poll when you could simply say, "Hey, ALFA, we're gonna try x and see if it works. If it doesn't, we'll withdraw it"? Like, planetouched and anything else along those lines. But, that'd be too simple, huh?
It's utterly amazing how politics and nonsense can drain the simplest of pleasures of its simplicity and its pleasure.
Hmm. I might make that my new sig.
Edit: P.S. GF (who was also in the NWN2 beta) and I tried to tell y'all that the density issue was a non-issue and that the server selection process was unecessary and retarded. But, did y'all listen? Noooooo. And, look now. And, we just had to go with the flow, because we NEEDED the process. Ah well.
ALFA... when you absolutely, positively have to kill every muthafukka in the room.
Anyway, a "formal process", which I think is utterly retarded in a gaming community, beyond yes/no, won't change a thing. As long as you have the silly system of re-electing admin every 6 months or whatever it is now, things will change. Things that stood before have changed. And things that stand now will change in the future. Y'all forget... the previous admin (Fluff and co.), as well as the admin that were in when I was lead (when NWN2 was out and I was in the beta test) all stated that Planetouched were in. But, the current admin, for some reason, decided to hold another vote and now they're out. A formal decision process will not make a bit of difference. If an incoming admin or a sitting admin wishes to change somethin' they don't like, or think serves the community better, they will or will damn sure try. It's inherent in a system like this. You take a 100 people and tell them to write a story with the same plot and same characters, you get 100 different stories. You keep re-electing different admin, you get a different way of thinkin' on ALFA's "direction".
That is the sad truth. As long as this system is in place, I don't care what you formalize. You can't have one admin change somethin' then tell the next admin not to touch it. Hell, if I were the new lead I'd change the planetouched decision simply because ALFA didn't even bother to test out planetouched real world before deciding they weren't in. And most of the decisions were based on ignorance or dislike of the races, not on what their actual in-game effect would be.
Why have formal processes when you could simply have a group of 5-7 admin with no domains who just make decisions, and do the stuff it takes to make the community, and gameworld run so that everybody has fun? Too straightforward, huh?
Why try and put every little, niggling item to a vote/poll when you could simply say, "Hey, ALFA, we're gonna try x and see if it works. If it doesn't, we'll withdraw it"? Like, planetouched and anything else along those lines. But, that'd be too simple, huh?
It's utterly amazing how politics and nonsense can drain the simplest of pleasures of its simplicity and its pleasure.
Hmm. I might make that my new sig.
Edit: P.S. GF (who was also in the NWN2 beta) and I tried to tell y'all that the density issue was a non-issue and that the server selection process was unecessary and retarded. But, did y'all listen? Noooooo. And, look now. And, we just had to go with the flow, because we NEEDED the process. Ah well.
ALFA... when you absolutely, positively have to kill every muthafukka in the room.
"You people have not given Private Pyle the proper motivation! So, from now on, when Private Pyle fucks up... I will not punish him. I will punish all of you! And the way I see it, ladies... you owe me for one jelly donut! Now, get on your faces!"
Well, one obvious problem with the "try it and see" approach on planetouched PC's is if the decision is "take them out," now you have players with live planetouched PC's that are going to be removed. Talk about grief. Though a "try it and see in beta" could have worked.
Also, change with each admin versus continuity of admin each have their problems. Continuity could easily lead to another [censored] if the admin are loony enough. Change prevents stability and puts people into camps that vie for control. If players were angels of like mind we would need no governance, to paraphrase an old saying.
Also, change with each admin versus continuity of admin each have their problems. Continuity could easily lead to another [censored] if the admin are loony enough. Change prevents stability and puts people into camps that vie for control. If players were angels of like mind we would need no governance, to paraphrase an old saying.
Last edited by Mulu on Fri Nov 23, 2007 10:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Click for the best roleplaying!
On NWVault by me:
X-INV, X-COM, War of the Worlds, Lantan University.