Adhoc Play: A discussion

[Rick7475]

I dunno. At first WD was awesome. Lots of players, lots to do, lots of DM's in my time zone. Then my fav PC died and I got the build bug. Built a fun server and met lots of great players and DM's. Then politiking took over and it didn't become fun anymore. I wasn't allowed to build a NWN2 server until no one else was helping Indio get a server up. So I helped him finish up TSM with the help of many others, but then politiking took over again and it wasn't fun. Now back to playing ... well, not many people on, all in different factions with few DM's: kinda of boring. So I decided to fork over $14 a month and play Warhammer. Greatest time ever. On a postive note, though, if you find a DM in a combatable time zone, and get with a group, this is the best. But that doesn't happen with everyone.

[oldgrayrogue]

What drew me to ALFA was its reputation for exceptional role play and the promise of a persistent world that replicated Faerun. I love the Forgotten Realms setting, and having played on a single NWN2 server for over a year, the possibility that I could travel with my PC between servers visiting Silverymoon, Waterdeep, Baldur's Gate etc was very appealing, and the idea of that still is.

In terms of Ad Hoc roleplay, whether DMd or not, I personally believe that is what brings a server full of static content to life. Ad Hoc RP also provides the story, the web that draws all of the player characters and the various static content together on a server. In my experience, the best campaigns I have participated in have been those generated from spontaneous player driven RP that a DM picks up on (maybe from an ad hoc dungeon crawl like that described by AL) and develops along with the players into something truly fantastic. The reason this works so well IMO is that it grows from the characters and their wants and desires, not from a cool concept conceived by a DM that players can play along with. I think that purely campaign driven, time slotted RP is inconsistent with the idea of a persistent world. It insulates the campaign group from the rest of the players on the server and tends to make the rest of the world around them irrelevent. When that happens people end up feeling left out and either don't play or find somewhere else to play. IMO it goes without saying that the more ad hoc DM content you have on a server the more lively a place it is and the more players enjoy their time there. When there are regular ad hoc events people log in more often in the hopes they might stumble on to one and get a nice surprise like AL describes in the OP. PC's also tend to discuss these events after the fact, and they take on a life of their own and become part of server "lore," again bringing the server to life. This translates to more RP opportunities for everyone in a vibrant world where something is always happening. It need not be earth shattering or life changing.

Campaigns certainly serve a purpose, are fun to participate in, and should be encouraged, but not at the expense of more ad hoc RP for everyone. If DM content turns exclusively to campaigns the NWN2 servers will become exactly what the NWN1 servers seem to have become: mostly empty "lifeless" worlds with no "reason" to visit except for the one or two days a week when a small fairly exclusive group gets together to play in them.

BTW I am by no means denigrating purely campaign PnP style play. That is also very enjoyable and works for many people to get their RP fix. Its just not a living, thriving, populated persistent world, which is what ALFA is billed as and certainly what drew me to it and to computerized DnD/ NWN2 gaming in general.

[Brokenbone]

There is definitely something to be said for character development in what a campaign focused group may end up otherwise thinking is "downtime." I.e., the hang around and shoot the breeze, or alternately, fiendish manipulation and planning prior to the next DM'd session, type of thing. Reviewing, reflecting, revising history, whatever.

It is nice to have settings other than taverns or campsites etc. for chats to take place, or other teamwork and whatnot to get practiced.

[ayergo]

I think that purely campaign driven, time slotted RP is inconsistent with the idea of a persistent world. It insulates the campaign group from the rest of the players on the server and tends to make the rest of the world around them irrelevent. When that happens people end up feeling left out and either don't play or find somewhere else to play.

These are my thoughts exactly. I've been trying to think of how to write down my first experience in ALFA and the promise of a persistent world. Once i sort it out i'll post it up.

[derekdrygon]

What initially interested me in ALFA was the permadeath environment and the extensive custom content available in the haks at the time (like visible cloaks).

After I applied and was accepted, I was woefully disappointed at the emptiness of the server on which I started. I had joined during a time when any static content was being torn from the server for fear of powergamers abusing said content. It was only the efforts of the DM's and players on the server involving me in the story that really hooked me. I would probably be playing in a different community if it weren't for that.

Back in those days, it was common to find people online at all hours. Despite the lack of content, the tavern RP was fairly enjoyable and kept me occupied while hoping for an ad-hoc DM to login. I found though that tavern RP, while enough for some, quickly lost its appeal to me. Sure, it’s great talking about your character's history, and meeting new people over a pint, but eventually I wanted to do something "heroic" since that's the reason why I play D&D. Alas these opportunities were not available unless a DM was logged in at the time, and even when they were, it was difficult to get certain people motivated to leave the tavern.

It wasn't until my character was "old enough" to travel cross server to shadowdale, and later daggerford, that I found any sort of content other then what the DM's ran. During my time on these two servers, I found a much more persistent environment. People logged in more frequently because there were things to do other then sit around waiting for a DM to login.

One of my most memorable moments on Shadowdale was completely improv, run by Brimsar. Another PC, Skimmer, and I were running one of the static quests on Shadowdale at the time. Unknown to us, Brimsar logged in, and saw us out and about. After our tangle with an ogre encampment, Brimsar chased us all the way back to the village proper with teleporting Ogre Magi. It was one of the most memorable moments I had on this server, a fleeing battle so desperate that we collapsed on the doorstep to the temple once we arrived back in town. This would have never been possible if it weren't for the static content providing us with motivation to "get out of town", and the easy adventure hook for Brimsar to pick up on.

Unfortunately when I played on Daggerford, the DM coverage was quite random and sparse. This did not prevent me and the other players from enjoying the server up until the time when the server went down due to technical issues. Daggerford had some of the most masterfully scripted content available on any of the servers I had experienced, and because of this, there always seemed to be players online. It’s a crying shame many of our gifted scripter’s no longer work on ALFA projects.

Later, on Luskan, though there was little static content available due to the newly live status of the server, my character played the role of "treasure hunter" seeking his wealth in the frozen tundra's to the north. While out wandering the wilderness, taking in the sights, my companions and I stumbled across a ruin out the middle of nowhere. When we set out on this journey, there were no DM's logged in at the time. We knew that we wouldn't encounter anything significant, maybe a random encounter or two, and any ruins we found would be "collapsed" or "locked shut" to explain their lack of an interior. But, it was still better then sitting around, waiting for something to happen. This time however was different; ThinkTank logged in while we were out exploring and decided to throw a little twist. The door to the ruined castle was unlocked by a key we found earlier, and we eventually ascended to the top and saved a giant fungus man from the "snake haired woman" who had enslaved him, forcing him to serve as her librarian.

As an interesting side note, since then, I have involved myself in multiple scheduled campaigns, and I must say I prefer this play style to anything else. I was lucky to find DM's interested in my character's story, who were willing to run with it. Furthermore it's nice to have set times where you're guaranteed DM attention. Nothing was more frustrating then sitting around waiting for something, anything, to happen. I don't think the change to a campaign server is necessarily a /bad/ thing per say, but it would be nice to have a more persistency since no matter how much I play I can never get enough

Slowly, over time, population on the servers dwindled to the point where they're at today. Servers started dropping like flies, and now there are only a few left. I was overjoyed when I heard that Zelk intended to host Waterdeep again, hoping this was the start of a reversal of our downward spiral. Unfortunately nothing seems to have come of this

The point I'm trying to make here is that without incentive to login, players to RP with, and stuff to do when the DM's aren't online, the servers are not likely to recover and once again be a full persistent world. It’s like a fuel injection system that's run dry. You can't start it again without some sort of outside stimulation. I'm not sure if this is an ongoing issue on just the NWN1 servers, or if they extend into NWN2; unfortunately I am unable to play NWN2 at this time. To fix this "problem" though, I believe that stimulus has to come from many different directions, here are various ideas.

1.) We need a strong influx of new and enthusiastic players, or something to rekindle interest in players who have lost interest or can't find a game (like the ability to play a second character, so they don't have to retire a long standing character who simply can't find a session to fit his/her character's story)

2.) We need something to keep people's interest outside of DM provided content. Ask any player, and I'm sure they'll say DM'd content is their favorite, but without static content there's no reason to login when the population of the server shows 0. It doesn't have to be elaborately scripted content, something as simple as a "go here, fetch this" quest is better then nothing. Most importantly it gets people out of the tavern. However in addition to that it has the benefit of giving people with low level characters and no "campaign" a means of advancement. Furthermore it’s a cheap and easy story hook for a DM to login and ad-hoc. Just a few DM placed traps here, a few unexpected critters there. DM possesses the big "bad guy", giving a bit of dialogue, and you've got yourself quite a memorable experience. If I wanted to RP a barfly I would go out to the bar IRL. The buzz is real, and there are a lot fewer lulls in the conversation.

3.) We need the witch-hunt crowd to relax if static content is added. I remember when I first started playing on Sembia, I was afraid to go out and do anything when there were no DM's online because of the people wielding the power/metagamer pitchforks at the time. When I expressed interest IC of going out to help "clear the graveyard" of those pesky undead who plague it, even right after a HUGE undead invasion of the city, players were reluctant to go out and utilize this static content. They were afraid of having a finger pointed at them and being labeled a powergamer for wanting to enjoy the game. I actually had to ask the HDM at the time, where the line was drawn for "powergaming" so that I could convince others that we wouldn't be stoned to death for something other then tavern RP.

4.) Re-examine the infrastructure and pillars if necessary so that they facilitate the following:

FUN!!! Everything else is moot if people aren't having fun. Furthermore admins should do everything in their power to encourage people to step up and get involved. The bureaucracy has scared away more content developers from our community then anything else. Cut away some of the red tape, and unnecessary restrictions to help motivate people! Stop operating under the assumption that everyone is just waiting to "take advantage" of everything and don't punish the masses for the actions of a few. For god's sake, there's no huge line of people banging down the door to host servers so keep in mind that anything is better then nothing when you review these applications. And finally offer people willing to build and add content incentives to keep them motivated!

These are just a few of my observations in my time playing here. I hope I'm not stoned to death for expressing my opinions



Derek Drygon
PC: Jo'dan

[kmj2587]

What was really hooked me and kept me in ALFA despite being told several times that it was in decline and I had already missed the "good ol' days" has been the campaign style play I've seen throughout most of my time here.

Personally, I find ad hoc play to be less immersive than campaign play. It might very well be in character for someone to be very dedicated to a certain plot and do whatever their character can to help, but with ad hoc play you end up spending a lot more time trying to explain why your character missed sessions than you would in campaign play where everyone knows and plans in advance. This is simply an issue I have with the concept of the Persistant World. In the case of PCs who need to do things that are time sensitive, or who simply want to catch an entire plot and get a full story rather than bits and pieces, it heavily rewards those who can dedicate a lot of time to it and punishes those who cannot.

I think the ad hoc system also results in the degradation of the story telling experience for long-term DM run plots. The ad hoc system lends itself to continually changing groups of players, such that the DM may be the only one with the full story. You potentially end up with a very large number of players, none of whom know the full extent of the plot. They all have whatever part of the story they happened to catch when they caught one of the ad hoc sessions. I personally find this can be quite frustrating, especially in situations where the swapping of plot information with other PCs can be seriously hampered by schedule issues. It's like reading a chapter in a book, then skipping a couple chapters and reading another, then going back and reading the cliff's notes for the chapters you skipped. Of course you didn't even necessarily start with the first chapter, and the Cliff's notes may not be available.

Ultimately I think the campaign vs. ad hoc DM question will be settled by the preferences and characteristics of those playing the game, and no amount of ideas or schemes is going to change that. This is not to say the input and suggestions of others is not worthwhile, but ultimately the rules and norms of the game are going to be determined by those who are playing. Most of the people I see in NwN1 these days are quite busy and do not have the option of dedicating much time to the game. With an ad hoc system, they would be heavily punished for this. The campaign system is not perfect in this respect either, and it does provides some barriers to entry for players trying to enter a campaign that has already begun. However, what it does provide is a highly satisfying story telling experience for those left that is not overly punitive for those who can only play once or twice a week.

To some degree I agree with Riotnrrd that there is something of a false dichotomy here. Players can still play ad hoc with one another, regardless of DM coverage, and they still do so. It is not as common as it used to be, but it still happens. We convene from time to time to discuss plots and make plans outside the scheduled sessions. Part of why I think there is not a terribly large amount of ad hoc play among players now is that most of the PCs are quite old. We've run the statics, and we've traded character stories. Player groups now are much like old married couples. They've all heard each other's stories a hundred times before. Right now on Shadowdale two player groups have basically merged with one another, and the level of activity on the server outside the campaigns has gone up a fair bit as the PCs get to know one another. Ad hoc play is by no means dead or even discouraged, it's just that there's little reason for PCs who've been around for many years to run the same statics and trade the same stories with their old friends time and again.

To the extent that anyone might think there is any truth to the above paragraph, it would seem that the relaxation of the one PC rule would be a very easy and quick way to increase the amount of ad hoc play which takes place. In my experience, DMs will not sit around on empty servers hoping for players to come by to increase the amount of ad hoc DMing, but DMs will drop by if players are already on. Thus, creating a scenario in which people want to play with or without a DM will likely result in an increase the amount of ad hoc DMing, allowing people who enjoy ad hoc to have their cake while not taking away from those who enjoy campaigns. Personally, I think campaign DMing is likely to continue to be the norm and I think the experiences of the players involved will be better for it. However, there is also a place for ad hoc play and DMing for those who enjoy it which doesn't have to take anything away from those who prefer their weekly campaigns.

[Zelknolf]

I think the ad hoc system also results in the degradation of the story telling experience for long-term DM run plots. The ad hoc system lends itself to continually changing groups of players, such that the DM may be the only one with the full story. You potentially end up with a very large number of players, none of whom know the full extent of the plot. They all have whatever part of the story they happened to catch when they caught one of the ad hoc sessions. I personally find this can be quite frustrating, especially in situations where the swapping of plot information with other PCs can be seriously hampered by schedule issues. It's like reading a chapter in a book, then skipping a couple chapters and reading another, then going back and reading the cliff's notes for the chapters you skipped. Of course you didn't even necessarily start with the first chapter, and the Cliff's notes may not be available.

I find this to be true when the DM expects the advancement of a central plot through ad hoc DMing; it's epidemic on other worlds, and it results, generally, in a collection of players who have no sense of the game world. Essentially, such a strategy creates the imperfect information that creates the RP foibles which reduce the quality of the world. However, that's easily prevented by making ad hoc sessions episodic, and to be sure that connections to major plots, if there are any, are tangential (adding depth to the story, rather than bringing advancement -- to expand on your metaphor, it would be like getting the footnotes after the chapters to miss such a session).

That's the kind of thing we should be covering in our DM training, though.

Oh wait.

[oldgrayrogue]

I think the ad hoc system also results in the degradation of the story telling experience for long-term DM run plots. The ad hoc system lends itself to continually changing groups of players, such that the DM may be the only one with the full story. You potentially end up with a very large number of players, none of whom know the full extent of the plot. They all have whatever part of the story they happened to catch when they caught one of the ad hoc sessions. I personally find this can be quite frustrating, especially in situations where the swapping of plot information with other PCs can be seriously hampered by schedule issues. It's like reading a chapter in a book, then skipping a couple chapters and reading another, then going back and reading the cliff's notes for the chapters you skipped. Of course you didn't even necessarily start with the first chapter, and the Cliff's notes may not be available.

IMO knowing only bits and pieces of a grand plot is more realistic and can be more interesting to RP. It is unlikely that everyone in a given region represented by a server -- the Silver Marches say, would have all the information that bears upon a plot or a quest -- i.e. a major event ongoing on the server. So why expect that a PC would know everything there is to know about a quest or feel at a disadvantage if they don't? IMO its much more interesting when your PC does not have all of the facts, or even draws wrong conclusions based on what little they do know. As an example, a PC I recently retired from TSM was tangentially involved in a few DM'd episodes of a major campaign that just concluded that involved a "mysterious lich" antagonist and an orc tribe attacking settlements. My PC also had several strong IC relationships, with much player ad hoc RP with some of those most heavily involved in the quest. In another ad hoc session, DMd by a different DM, my PC encountered a drow on the surface under mysterious circumstances. The PC became convinced the drow were behind the plot underlying the campaign, and this belief provided the impetus for hours of RP involving numerous other players searching to find this (supposed) hidden drow threat to the Marches. Reacting to false or partial information through RP, and experiencing all of the emotions that go along with that through your PC's perspective, can be just as interesting and rewarding as seeing a well thought out campaign through to its ultimate conclusion, or perhaps even more rewarding.

The point of the above is that only through frequent ad hoc gaming is this sort of inclusive RP even possible, and again it is what makes a PW come alive and seem realistic. With closed campaigns you have small insular groups off doing their thing and everyone else waiting for it to be their turn to do the same. Don't get me wrong, I think campaigns should be run and often. Nor do they need to include everyone. But additional and frequent spice and ad hoc content serves the dual purpose of occupying those players not fortunate enough to have a central part in the campaign, or even better as in my example above, providing the impetus (perhaps even incorrect) to believe they are involved in that plot and to take action on it with other players, with or without a DM. IMO this is exactly what would occur in actuality in a region beset by the types of things we see in a DM'd campaign: A few people who really know what is happening and trying to deal with it and lots of other people who know only bits and pieces and are reacting to it in their own ways, often incorrect, or perhaps playing only a small supporting role. That to me is a simulation of realism which is the goal of all RP driven persistent worlds, or should be.

The idea, to me, is to foster an environment that is conducive to numerous and frequent RP opportunities for the greatest number of players at any given time. Campaign play alone can never accomplish that IMO.

[Teric neDhalir]

Hi all,
While we're all in essay writing mode I'll join in..

But first, to answer AL's original question I guess the "hooks" went in playing on Pitlatch's Beta version of Chondath when he Dm'd an impromptu session for me: the paradigm shift of NPCs starting to respond to you personally was enough to make me realise that this was a totally different experience to just "playing a game". My playing time in NWN1 was a wash-out, I suppose, in terms of what is considered successful play, but the one thing I found was that having character goals completely independant of any need for DM involvement certainly made things easier. My longest running character decided he was going to make maps of servers and that's what he did for 18 months. Made me a bit of gold, too.

In terms of coming up with ways to get more people involved more often I have always thought there is a "third way" between DM extemporising and DM campaigns. My intention for 011 is that it should in some ways be more like a traditional computer game in that you would expect to have to explore and interact with the environment in order to "progress". To avoid waffling these are the guidelines I've put forward on the 011 Builder forum:

Hi all,
Part of the reason for my involvement in building for ALFA is the opportunity to try out some different ways of dealing with several of the core activities of our game. To be slightly contentious I believe that many of our long-running problems are caused by badly thought out design or a "that's the way it's always been done" attitude. I believe that my approach to spawns on the OAS (encounter tables, herd behaviours, morale script etc) has worked quite well which encourages me to try a different approach to quest-giving and DM time on 011.

There are several issues issues here which I hope to hit with one shot. First up is DM time. The tendancy is to revert to a default posture of the DM session, i.e. DMJimBob has his storyline running on a Wednesday and if you're part of it then lucky you. I appreciate this is a gross slander on our hard-working DMs but you get my point. Not only does this exclude players who can't play at that time but also raises the spectre of PCs belting up and down the High Road between DMJimBob on Wednesdays and DMGloria on Saturdays. Or in some cases crossing back and forth between servers.
Second is creating plots. I'm afraid that my small amount of experience DMing on the OAS shows that I'm rather lousy at making it up as I go along. Despite enormous familiarity with the setting I'm still at a loss for providing the players with something to do. I would much rather be able to take something that has been prepared in advance and run that. The Lyrans Hold dungeon on the OAS is a good example. Because it's all pre-made and fully scripted it's more fun for me to watch and also, I hope, a richer experience for the players.
Third up is standards. We've got to have them and I think that the only way to maintain consistency across the whole DM corps of the server is to have most of the rewards clearly marked in advance. Also, because XP and gold rewards need to be in lockstep we stand far more chance of being accurate if they are calculated calmly rather than in the normal post-adventure chaos.
Fourthly encounters. Due to the nature of the scaled travel areas in the mod dropping a few creatures on a party to give them something to do is no longer an option.

I would like, therefore, to propose the following guidelines (Note: this does not prevent anyone from running ad-hoc sessions or longer campaigns but I want a lot of the following content to be available at all times):

- Much more DMed content must be provided via conversations from NPCs, on examining found objects and so on. The conversation system in the toolset has the ability to test for a vast range of properties and I want to provide much more "targeted" activities based on things like class, level, race, deity, gender etc and any combination thereof. Players fulfilling the quest criteria will be told that if they want to accept they should contact a DM.
- If a player is offered a DMed session then it is their responsibility to organise any allies they want to help them either through RP or on the forums. The DM will negotiate on session times with the quest receiver only.
- All embedded content will be fully documented in these forums and easily locatable through the use of a reference number. Any blueprints (creatures, plot items, etc) that the DM will need to create during the adventure should also be clearly documented.
- The plot hooks should be clear enough to understand that any DM can run the adventure.
- Rewards for the adventure should be clearly marked and guidelines given for scaling the rewards based on party size and level. (I'll post guidelines for standards later).

I also hope that this forum can act as a "script meeting" where we can chip in with suggestions on each other's work. I know that I have quite a few half ideas that could do with polishing up and hope that you will be able to help.

Thanks for reading, [more to come]
Teric

[danielmn]

The hook for this place for me involved my time on the OAS under Covet, in a plot which involved a lich, vampires of different alliances, and a slew of applicants/members. I had yet to find a community dedicated to the progression of a character or the persistency until I practically stumbled over Alfa. I stayed there a bit longer than I should have, partly because it had become so familiar, because the server I chose to start on Live didn't have a lot going on, and because no one was really there offering a hand and pointing me in the direction of funness. Had to figure all of that out on my own, which is a bit intimidating when you first step in out of the cold. Honestly, after my time on the OAS, I would have moved on in my search if not for Aerthrin. He got my butt into sembia...which prompted a move to shadowdale and I expanded outward, getting hooked on cursed lakes and orc invasions and exploration.

The real Hook I suppose came with Longhorn, and the player of Kevin Choronach and a few others in shadowdale...all of us new players, all of us meeting without dms to explore the server and walk through static content. Sitting up at the Old SKull and rping with all the other folks who'd been in alfa awhile was fun and riviting as well. Honestly, I can only remember one or two session for the months I was on shadowdale to begin with where a dm was involved, I believe the dm crew was sparse and campaign focused then, and we were on the outside looking in. Still it was enjoyable and we made our own fun without outside help, and it was entertaining for us.

As for the Campaign vs Persistance...I've been on both sides of the campaign fence a multitude of times. Being on the cold side is bearable if you have other people to rp with, not so much if it's just you...which is what happened to me over time. I've also been privy to awesome adhoc campaigns run by Miz and recently Wynna that completely rocked. I have to agree with OGR, not having all the peices to the puzzle is a hoot and a blast, and all of the misconceptions and false assumptions are awesome to rp! I prefer not having all of the peices and using what peices I do have to figure out the mess in a campaign. I'm also involved in a campaign with Nalo atm that is scheduled, and while it is cool and fun, I miss being able to connect with the other pc's on an ad-hoc basis, sometimes it feels too plastic, especially if your a newcomer not being told backgrounds, or why things are happening. I suppose Adhoc lets you focus on what your pc wants to do as well, rather than reacting to what the dm throws at you. I much prefer advancement through rp rather than advancement through xp. But I don't think there is a right or wrong, I think those who wanted persistance in NWN1 have moved on, and those that want a campaign style stayed and have formed their own groups with their own dms. Nothing wrong with either way, but I prefer Ad-hoc rather than scheduled myself, and if it is scheduled having down time between sessions to rp is a must bonus. My preference has led me to play a lot of NWN2, and very little NWN1 of late. The beast evolved, and I evolved with it.

Daniel

[Vintenar]

I can deffinitaly appreciate what the OP is saying and was actually thinking about this same topic today.

Being a newer person means it is harder to break into already formed campaigns and close knit parties meaning you will naturally get less deep DM attention. That can mean that statics become more of a staple, and trying to survive them solo if at all possible is important. Unfortunately, low level statics give out such small rewards that DM attention at very low level becomes extremely necessary, thus making a catch 22 if you will.

[dergon darkhelm]

My ALFA hook was the combination of ad hoc play combined with regular campaign play.

I logged into TLR and had an ecperience familiar to many who ever started a PC there ...... I appeared naked at the fire rind in Triboar with 5 PCs gathered 20 feet from me.

I got a polite barrage of OOC tells telling me to get some gear before we considered it IC...

But there were people right there playing and ready to go the moment I logged in.

Then came the Campaings spanning western Faerun which really hooked me. Down to WD with Kail, up to TSM with Beleg, all over TLR with a thick player base spanning a wide breadth of PC types and nearly guaranteed DM involvement if you were on for an hour. (Yes.....I am an unrepentent "server hopper" but that's a flame war for another day).

Anyway... the ideal for me is what I saw back in mid '05. Ad hoc play combined with regular play. I enjoy both facets and, being one of those 20+ hours a week guys, can do both.

But I bet I'll prolly still be hanging around ALFA regardless of how it morphs over time.......I really like it here.

[psycho_leo]

IMO knowing only bits and pieces of a grand plot is more realistic and can be more interesting to RP. It is unlikely that everyone in a given region represented by a server -- the Silver Marches say, would have all the information that bears upon a plot or a quest -- i.e. a major event ongoing on the server. So why expect that a PC would know everything there is to know about a quest or feel at a disadvantage if they don't? .

The problem for me is not really about not knowing all the possible details. It's more like not knowing stuff you really should, because it's affecting your PC directly and even more, not participating in things your character otherwise would if you had time. The last such thing that happened to me was back when I was still playing on TSM and Wynna ran an all night battle against orc tribes in defense of Rivermoot. My PC was there during the nights before, when everyone was talking about an upcoming attack He was even there a few hours before the actual session and took part in some of the preparation RP, but then I had to leave and didn't take part on the fight. In the next day, everyone and their mother were talking about the fight. That is my problem with having only (or mostly)ad-hoc playing and why I like campaign style.

[Brokenbone]

Sometimes an announced event, like the resolution of well, ANY major plot, can end up completely unsatisfying to some or all participants, DM included, as well. Anything from "can't get a word in edgewise", "ringers who had no role with the plot mysteriously show up", "can't manage a 12 person party", "people running around or stealth scouting to ninja-loot everything like it's a race", "key participants who miss feel badly to have missed the climax" to "key participants couldn't make it and will get IC blame (cowardice, dereliction, whatever) for OOC situations."

DM roles re: story & the chance to inject narrative also tend to get lost if a climax is treated like an MMORPG "raid." Probably DM abilities to keep balance, especially after a long slugfest in the toolset, are also impaired (gee I used DC x locks and DC y traps throughout this lair, can't change them now, didn't know a Super-rogue with his magic thieves' tools would parachute in and cakewalk this all...)

[Rotku]

My first hundred characters died on Daggerdale without ever seeing a sight of a DM (or seeing it from a distance). My next fifty or so died on Waterdeep, before I got my first glimps of ad-hoc DMing. And then, after finally giving up on playing, I volunteered to DM on The Pirate Isles (beta) - and that was when the real fun began.

What kept me through the first four months, I don't know. But the hook for me, was certainly Beta 3 The Pirate Isles. I got a chance to work with a brilliant team - I was able to log in each day to a great player base. Some days we would have some of the best RPing I've ever seen, while other days we were able to kick off our shoes, and have stupid fun games like troll hunting, PvP ship raids and wars and other fun things that one can only really do on Beta. Those are the "good old days" for me. Then the Quake happened, and pitlatch took a big role in rebuilding and TPI sort of faded for a bit.

So I guess for me what hooked me was been able to DM such a fun player base.