Lo-jack for your PC

[Inaubryn]

I was talkin' to somebody in chat last night and the subject of server hopping came up. And that person asked me if PCs can be tracked. I told him I don't know but I'm sure they could. Or I might have said yes. Don't remember. Either way, it was suggested that something that tracked what servers a player logs in and out of could be placed on their PC for DMs to read with a wand. So, essentially DMs could click "Show attributes for [insert PC name]" and it would pull up the same info as it does now in addtion to pulling up the last server the PC logged into and/or out of and maybe even the time. But, this way the DM could tell where the PC has been. So if that PC was on that DMs server (Thay) last night with that DM and the DM comes back the next night, wands the PC and it shows that he had just come from WD not too long ago, that can red flag possible server hoppin'.

Now, this all hinges on DMs that care and that suspect certain individuals may be server-hopping. So what say you techie 'bout somethin' like this? And what are the pros and cons of somethin' like this?

Oh. I was also thinkin' this may could be tied into teleport spells. Tracks the PC and compiles a list of servers the PC's been to. Hmm. Wonder if you could tie it into the DM chooser interface where it would bring up areas of the mod the PC has been to and they can choose those areas to jump to as a DM does. They'd only be able to see areas they've been in. So the player could have an intra-server teleport list and an inter-server teleport list.

Techs?

[ç i p h é r]

The tracking part of this is very much in our plans already (travel history between servers), either as part of our portalling system or logging system (1984).

The chooser suggestion is interesting. I don't know what kind of control we have over that though. Regardless, I'm not so sure it'd work that well - how would it get updated? If a DM has to target the PC with a wand or some other device, then going to the chooser just to see the results is awkward. Better to fire up a dialogue with selectable options. That's my opinion of course.

[Voersaa]

IMO the players that travelled a lot between servers happened to do so because we, as a PW, were spread WAY to thin. And now we will be implementing a big brother tool to solve a problem that is caused by insufficient interaction.

That's like treating the effects of an illness and ignoring its cause.

[ç i p h é r]

Information gathering in and of itself is meaningless. How it can be used isn't and yes, I share your concern that this data could be used inappropriately. But we're not just looking at one part of the equation here either and trying to force a square peg through a round hole. Most, if not all, of us recognize the problems that came about in NWN1 and we're trying to build solutions, but rules enforcement is always going to be necessary and we therefore need the monitoring tools to facilitate that. In this case, a global travel system, adequate static content, minimum DM coverage standards, and managed server releases should help mitigate the root causes greatly.

[Inaubryn]

Right on.

[Voersaa]

I would agree if it wasn't for the fact that abusers have to go to extreme ends before they were ever busted in ALFA. AFK we had systems in place that should have been able to pick up on abusers but being pals with the a DM or two would buy you a lot of power.

Meanwhile being on the bad side of one of the nuttier DM's could get you killed or branded as an abuser.

With what we’ve seen from insane DM's (pardon my choice of words but there have been a few) this is a problem more than a solution.

I for one would see it as a much greater problem when a powerful group on the Dragon Coast for instance learns (and everyone knows that it is meta gaming disguised as RP) of a high profile quest on the Sword Coast that is part of a different parties campaign. Then the high level party suddenly turns up kills the dragon, saves the day and completely railroads the mid-level party that was part of the campaign from the beginning.

ALFA has always been about politics and being friends with the right people. Setting up a big brother system will only hurt those that get on the wrong side of megalomaniac DM’s.

On a side note. Why the concern about teleportation being caught up in a monitoring tool like this. Server jumping should be no more legit simply because you can explain out of chr. behaviour through in game rules. High level mages that server jump are just as abusive as everyone else.

EDIT: I obviously haven't gotten a lot of DM/builder experience but this thing sounds like building a tool just for the tool itself, rather than to actually deal with another major problem.
If people are doing MAJOR serving jumping then it should be obvious. Hell we've had MAJOR PG'ers in ALFA from day one that are still here and everyone knew that they have abused the rules but no one bothered to act because they were powerful people.

I'm not saying that this thing shouldn't be build but rather I'm questioning just what the hell it is supposed to solve?

[Zelknolf]

Well, in response to the story of the high levelers traveling across Faerun to finish another DM's high-profile plot, that's the other DM's fault, honestly. I'm one of the opinion that server hoppers are best handled by not DMing them, and if they try to nose into someone else's plot, sometimes the best thing to do is approach them OOC to say "Hey, this plot isn't meant for your group. These other players have invested a lot of time and energy into the development of this plot, and it would be exceptionally cruel to them to allow another group to steal that."

Throw in that it's not nearly as fun to catch only a quarter of such a character's development (as I'm sure their "home" server's DM would have to suffer as well because of the hopping), and DMing a hopper just sounds crappy. Best to let them be transient, and let them move through. If they settle in an area, you stop treating them as transients. If such a tool was introduced, I know that I (and hopefully most DMs) would use it on a PC to help the tell what kinds of players they have in the server.

[Voersaa]

If such a tool was introduced, I know that I (and hopefully most DMs) would use it on a PC to help the tell what kinds of players they have in the server.

But wouldn't it in the first place be the DM's responsibility to figure out where from and what a 6th level chr. are doing walking onto the server, when you have never seen him before?

Also are DM's not supposed to be DM's for everyone and not just the ones who they feel are loyal to whatever ALFA is?

ALFA has never been big enough (ok maybe initially) not to know who these people are.

But lets address a different problem then. What about logging onto a server knowing that you will go into quarantine. The purpose being to discuss something OOC with a DM, or player, that you need to have cleared. Would the server jumping tracker (from now on officially know as the "SJT") register when you log back onto your domestic server?

[Inaubryn]

But lets address a different problem then. What about logging onto a server knowing that you will go into quarantine. The purpose being to discuss something OOC with a DM, or player, that you need to have cleared. Would the server jumping tracker (from now on officially know as the "SJT") register when you log back onto your domestic server?

Use a dead or retired PC. Or create a PC to use for that purpose if you absolutely must do that.

[Voersaa]

But lets address a different problem then. What about logging onto a server knowing that you will go into quarantine. The purpose being to discuss something OOC with a DM, or player, that you need to have cleared. Would the server jumping tracker (from now on officially know as the "SJT") register when you log back onto your domestic server?

Use a dead or retired PC. Or create a PC to use for that purpose if you absolutely must do that.

Good point;-)

But should we be spending valuable resources developing something like this initially, when there are so many other things that needs to be done?

I would hope that monitoring tools such as this (that may end up being completely useless) will be at the bottom of the "to do list" in the struggle to go live.

[Zelknolf]

But wouldn't it in the first place be the DM's responsibility to figure out where from and what a 6th level chr. are doing walking onto the server, when you have never seen him before?

Also are DM's not supposed to be DM's for everyone and not just the ones who they feel are loyal to whatever ALFA is?

ALFA has never been big enough (ok maybe initially) not to know who these people are.

Currently, yes, when I haven't seen a character before I figure out where they're from, generally by looking at the tags of the items they're carrying, and simply asking them if that's not tell-tale enough. And no, DMs don't have to be DMs for everyone- we all have the option to simply not DM a player or character that we don't want to. We would lose the vast majority of our DMs if any rule remotely oppressive enough to require anything else was imposed upon them.

[Voersaa]

we all have the option to simply not DM a player or character that we don't want to. We would lose the vast majority of our DMs if any rule remotely oppressive enough to require anything else was imposed upon them.

Agreed but that is what you sign up for when you become a DM. Just like a judge swears to do justice to anyone acused that comes before him. DM's have to follow the freaking rules like everyone else - sorry guys you are not special!

Innocent until convicted.

Why is it so important for everyone to monitor the travels of players. Enlighten me since I’ve I haven't played for the last 18 months?

Regardless of the missing answers to my MANY questions in this thread I now feel that I shall rest since I have put forth my doubt about this particular subject.

[Zelknolf]

Agreed but that is what you sign up for when you become a DM. Just like a judge swears to do justice to anyone acused that comes before him. DM's have to follow the freaking rules like everyone else - sorry guys you are not special!

Innocent until convicted.

Why is it so important for everyone to monitor the travels of players. Enlighten me since I’ve I haven't played for the last 18 months?

I did agree to a series of standards and statements when I became a DM, yes, and I follow them, same as 95% of DMs.

We don't need to monitor them, don't think we have any rules on a maximum server travel alloted, unless it's hopping for DM farming. I just said that it's not fun for me to DM server hoppers, and I know many DMs share this sentiment. If this got tooled, chances are, it'd be used to give DMs a good idea of how long they can expect a PC to be around.