30 Day Timer Request

This is a general open discussion for all ALFA, Neverwinter Nights, and Dungeons & Dragons topics.

Moderator: ALFA Administrators

HEEGZ
Dungeon Master
Posts: 7085
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 4:17 pm
Location: US CST

30 Day Timer Request

Post by HEEGZ »

I would like to formally request that our administration change the timer for playing a PC where you recently DM'd from 30 days down to something shorter. Perhaps 3 days, 7 days, or at most 10 days.

I think there is very little risk of our current crop of [potential] DMs abusing meta knowledge as a PC. Also, I think this change may motivate people to step up to DM more often. I know that would be the case for myself. If I knew that I could DM for a couple months, and then after a week break I could play again, I would be more willing to DM. As it stands now, the current rule is one of the main reasons I don't DM more often.

Thanks for considering this request.
Zelknolf
Chosen of Forumamus, God of Forums
Posts: 6139
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2005 7:04 pm

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by Zelknolf »

I would like to ask, from the tech perspective, that a server reset be required for whatever span of time it is. There are ~some~ persistent effects that could be left across resets, but we either largely don't care (like from building) or have robust logging (persistent storage) to deter any shenanigans. Otherwise, various unusual states that a server can be left in (probably unintentionally) by a DM are a concern from my perspective, and it would be pretty obnoxious to write the logging necessary to meaningfully inform someone investigating a complaint, when three clicks on the website can spare us all from even having to entertain said complaint.

Indeed, even if it remains at 30 days, we should require that restart. Sometimes we actually don't restart our servers that often. Though we should. NWN2 Server was designed to run for an afternoon, and we've extended that out to "a couple weeks."
HEEGZ
Dungeon Master
Posts: 7085
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 4:17 pm
Location: US CST

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by HEEGZ »

I don't see an issue with restarting a server when a DM reverts to player status there. Seems like a good idea really.

I don't understand the technical implications of some of the things you are referencing. I get that we obviously want to prevent cheating and twinking, etc.
User avatar
kid
Dungeon Master
Posts: 2675
Joined: Mon Aug 03, 2009 11:08 am

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by kid »

I think mainly to prevent leaving yourself an encounter/loot somewhere.
<paazin>: internet relationships are really a great idea
johnlewismcleod
Dungeon Master
Posts: 2021
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2008 1:37 am
Location: Tarrant County, Texas

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by johnlewismcleod »

If it means HEEGZ will DM more often, I vote yes 8)
I seek plunder....and succulent greens


[Wynna] Chula Lysander: [Talk] *Shakes head* I've been in worse situations. He was just....unjoyful! *stomps foot*


Retired PC's: Torquil, Gwenevere
Former PC's: Rugo, Flora, Rory Mor
User avatar
Arianna
Tech Admin
Posts: 1660
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2004 2:28 pm
Location: Idaho PST

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by Arianna »

kid wrote:I think mainly to prevent leaving yourself an encounter/loot somewhere.

Maybe it should be a 10 day timer and the HDM/EADM of what ever server the Person was DMing on should reset the server .. . just cause . . .

10 days gives plenty of time for plots to shift and players to move on

Resetting the server makes it harder for any DM to leave themselves loot laying around for when they become a player . . .


*just my two cents*
Current NWN2 PC: TSM- Lessa

HDM of Moonshae Server DM on BG
Builder Everywhere
DM times - 6:30-10 PM Saturdays PDT on MS . . other times as I show up
PM me on Discord if you want to be DMd on BG I have Monday nights available
Talk to me if you want to learn to build for NWN2

Tech Admin
SwordSaintMusashi
Mook
Posts: 963
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2005 4:49 pm
Location: Virginia
Contact:

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by SwordSaintMusashi »

I would go with a DM can play after a server reset, per Zelknolf's suggestion.
Current PCs:
Zova Earth Breaker, Monk of Rasheman
Alyra Ashedown, Knight Commander of Silverymoon
Zelknolf
Chosen of Forumamus, God of Forums
Posts: 6139
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2005 7:04 pm

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by Zelknolf »

HEEGZ wrote:I don't understand the technical implications of some of the things you are referencing.
The unintentional things seem like the ones most likely to happen. The thing I just ran caused Durlag's tower to be completely cleared, and then I'm not thinking about that when my PC goes there, and then loot still shoots out of firehoses there.

There's also more-direct stuff, yeah; self twinking and such. Which I'd like to say that nobody would do-- but we have had problems with DMs running crafting for players specifically so the products of that crafting could be sold to the DM's character at a discount. That's probably under the category of "It happens once, so people will think it can happen, so admin will be stuck repeatedly figuring out if it did happen"-- and searches for stuff that didn't happen tend to take a lot longer.

Especially because there's drama and fallout regardless of what such investigations turn up. Doesn't matter what you do; a conclusion means ragequits from some and malaise from the people who stay, and those things suck.
User avatar
Brokenbone
Chosen of Forumamus, God of Forums
Posts: 5771
Joined: Mon May 16, 2005 1:07 am
Location: London, Ontario, Canada

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by Brokenbone »

A time limit of "come back whenever you want as long as there's been a reset" may make dipping a toe into DMing more attractive to everyone.

It could presumably apply equally to the 2 PC shuffle, so there's no "dead turf" for anyone looking for groups and game.

Some reminder of the existing rule of "hey, no metagaming" also applies equally re: DMs and 2nd PCs. If you discussed and/or built for some major plot arc with someone as a fellow DM, then quit to go participate in that arc, hey that might be not such a hot idea, bad optics. Much like if PC1 knows the big dark secret and PC2 wanders in and oddly bumbles into that same secret without any investigation,t hat's all metagaming anyhow. It is not as if a day or two vs. a month changes that.

I suppose our various HDM fiefdoms could set an across the board rule for "come on back, post reset / post 3 days / 5 days / 15 days / 30 days" whatever, or just do case by case "sure, we trust ex-DM (insert name), let me reset here and you can be back on in 15 minutes while this stabilizes..."
ALFA NWN2 PCs: Rhaggot of the Bruised-Eye, and Bamshogbo
ALFA NWN1 PC: Jacobim Foxmantle
ALFA NWN1 Dead PC: Jon Shieldjack

DMA Staff
User avatar
Lokan
Dungeon Master
Posts: 821
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2009 8:28 am

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by Lokan »

If i get a vote, or voice in things these days. I would vote on the "as soon as the HDM can reset the server" model. Also DMs should resolve any plots they initiate prior to stepping out of the DM role and into the player roll. At very least just put down a forum narrative either IC or DM forums that settles things.

I have in the past picked up former DM plots that have fizzled, or faded away and put different spins on them, and even placed the former DM's PCs in the thick of the plot. This was not by design of the former DM, its just that I read the DM forums and try to use some things from the server's past lore, rather then see things as individual separate occurrences that have no persistence. In these instances the former DM had no idea i was picking his plot back up, and it was several months after the DM was playing again.

I guess if we as a whole are worried about cheating, the oversight of the HDM with reset of the server before the DM sets up a PC on the server would be satisfactory to me. So, some sort of resolution to DM plots one way or another before they leave the DM seat would be enough to satisfy the hardened Rpers here?
Current PC: IS NOT Dent Jars
User avatar
Arianna
Tech Admin
Posts: 1660
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2004 2:28 pm
Location: Idaho PST

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by Arianna »

I still think there should be a 7 to 10 day waiting period for a DMing coming back to play on the server they just were DMing on
Current NWN2 PC: TSM- Lessa

HDM of Moonshae Server DM on BG
Builder Everywhere
DM times - 6:30-10 PM Saturdays PDT on MS . . other times as I show up
PM me on Discord if you want to be DMd on BG I have Monday nights available
Talk to me if you want to learn to build for NWN2

Tech Admin
User avatar
kid
Dungeon Master
Posts: 2675
Joined: Mon Aug 03, 2009 11:08 am

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by kid »

restart + 7 (10?) days, should satisfy most concerns I think.

Some plots would last over 10 days, but they would last over 30 too. Sometimes in 30 days the plot doesn't even move at all. Happens.

So in the interest of gaining people DM time as well as play time... Might be worth it to alter this.

As stated before, if we shorten the DM wait time it should probably be just as safe to shorten the player 2nd PC wait time.

Might be worth it, personally I can't see much risk involved.
<paazin>: internet relationships are really a great idea
User avatar
Lokan
Dungeon Master
Posts: 821
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2009 8:28 am

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by Lokan »

I think "whenever the HDM can reset the server" would usually mean 7-10 days.
Current PC: IS NOT Dent Jars
User avatar
Arianna
Tech Admin
Posts: 1660
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2004 2:28 pm
Location: Idaho PST

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by Arianna »

Lokan wrote:I think "whenever the HDM can reset the server" would usually mean 7-10 days.

NOT always . . . I can reset MS within 24 hours , I am pretty sure BG and TSM could be reset within 24 -48 hours as well . . . WHL . .who knows
Current NWN2 PC: TSM- Lessa

HDM of Moonshae Server DM on BG
Builder Everywhere
DM times - 6:30-10 PM Saturdays PDT on MS . . other times as I show up
PM me on Discord if you want to be DMd on BG I have Monday nights available
Talk to me if you want to learn to build for NWN2

Tech Admin
User avatar
Heero
Beholder
Posts: 1930
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2004 9:52 pm

Re: 30 Day Timer Request

Post by Heero »

The Official Voice and Administrator of the People has concerns with neither the suggestion of a 7 day wait nor that of a server reset, or any combination thereof, prior to re-engaging in play by any former DM.

So it is written.
Heero just pawn in game of life.

12.August.2013: Never forget.
15.December.2014: Never forget.

The Glorious 12.August.2015: Always Remember the Glorious 12th.
Locked