Your opinion on ALFA's current wealth levels

[ç i p h é r]

I wish the DMs of my country would start giving me money so that everyone in the country has the same amount.

Sounds like a great solution to me. Execute the wealthy and redistribute the wealth amongst those in the Party and the proletariat.

Viva la revolución!

Seems like the numbers are almost even all the way across. No clear problem. No clear mandate. That tells me we're probably not asking the right question.

How about another poll that's a bit more gameplay related, which ties back to the money sinks thread?

Would you prefer a stingy world where coin is always hard to come by with few if any money sinks?

- or -

would you prefer having gold more readily available but with greater numbers and diversity of money sinks?

If it's 50/50, start shooting people until you tip the scales...attrition for the sake of consensus.

[idoru]

That would be like asking people "do you want free candy." Of course everyone wants free candy. Human nature.

ALFA 2 is going to be lower wealth than ALFA 1 currently is. Most of you will not notice any difference at all, but if your local DM has been giving you 100 XP per hour for delivering notes and 100 gold in reward for each message, well.. you're in for a surprise.

[Vendrin]

Unless on that message lies the fate of a city and you must deliver across the bridge of death past the Dragon of Agnor, fight to the death against the Chicken of Bristol and sneak through the battle at Badon Hill.

[ç i p h é r]

That would be like asking people "do you want free candy." Of course everyone wants free candy. Human nature.

Not free candy, just more candy with commensurate visits to the dentist.

In other words, you'll have more money but will also need to spend it on things you don't presently have to. I think we could achieve the same net result vis-a-vis wealth by thinking a little out-of-the-box and creating a variety of money sinks that support a broad range of levels. Requiring players to spend coin instead of never having any or hording it (these are the extremes that exist here in ALFA) can keep wealth to a reasonable level but also make the game more interesting, fun, and dynamic in the process for all level of play.

Being stingy with gold is a solution to limiting wealth, certainly, but it's not the only solution and clearly not much fun. If it were, we'd all be beggars, right? We may have to remind ourselves from time to time that this is a game and it still has to be fun for those who play it. RPing is rewarding. Being poor enhances RP. Being poor ALL THE TIME is neither rewarding nor anyone's idea of fun RP.

I'm not saying that using money sinks creatively and wisely is THE BEST solution to regulating wealth or that it can be done with absolute certainty. I'm saying that we might think on it if most people in the community agree it's a better way than keeping a tight string on the ALFA money purse. These would be IG measures primarily. There should still be DM guidelines to help establish a balanced risk vs reward system, but the quantities could also be given consideration accordingly.

Just my thought provoking comments for the afternoon.

[Cassiel]

This isn't going to get at the possibly hypothetical situation where some players are very wealthy and some players are very poor...it doesn't address wealth *imbalance*. YMMV.

[Grey Pilgrim]

i for one would hate to see a situation where all players had to have equal wealth according to some set of guidelines.

i would, however, like to see all players have the same opportunities for success. that means consistency across servers and dms and the erosion of excessive favouritism.

[Sandermann]

You mean Character wealth surely? I dont think Player wealth affects the game, unless you mean we should all be able to afford faster computers for NWN2

on a serious note: The "imbalance" is brought on a by a small few extremely wealthy PCs rather than a general over flow of wealth. Please find a way to recitfy the extreme top end of wealth levels without further punishing everyone else, please?

[Cassiel]

Right - my point was largely that I know of a number of players who I regard as excellent RPers who have almost no money whatever. They are, and probably should be, voting for more money - but that's because their characters are way below the current suggested guidelines for their level.

Taken in isolation, then, you could end up bumping up the guidelines - which would just mean that those players who get rewards in line with them anyway get more money while those who don't still don't have anything.

May I suggest that a better question would be something like "Do you think the wealth guidelines by level as set out by the standards team are (a) being adhered to and (b) reasonable?"

[AlmightyTDawg]

Seeing as a fair amount of the discussion has turned to standards, and there's all this lovely groundswell of interest in the subject, I think I'm going to abuse it and turn it to my personal benefit.

On the Standards forum right now is the proposed formal wealth guidelines, including an FAQ fleshing things out a bit better than what just tables do. It's been up for DM commentary for roughly 5 weeks now, and totalling about 40 page views conservatively, I think we can safely say we've given the DM commentary portion of our program the full run.

I'll post them up here as soon as I can get a mod to lock the thing to keep it clean. At least then people will have something concrete to discuss, if perhaps a slight long-winded. Be sure to focus less on the tables than on the FAQ, as numbers are really just that. I think the FAQ will show that, as I believe Cynon pointed out among others, this is really about consistency and education more than it is about effects on players.

Edit: Posted at http://www.alandfaraway.org/phpbbforum/ ... hp?t=24289

[Cynon]

[Edit] I want to rethink my opinion before i comment. i do think the cutoffs and high ends are too low and the item values for levels are a bit stingy but i wrote that post to fast and in a huff. i don't want to start a thread of abuse.

[AlmightyTDawg]

Just as an indication where the base numbers came from, they started with bumping the average from DMG Table 5-1 by 30%, and then adjusting by 45% from that average plus/minus... then another 45% to get to the warning cutoff. The max DM award per level value was taken by 25% of the "ALFA average, so the following numbers and their relation to the DMG Table 5-1 averages by level are:

• Low End: 71.5%
• Average: 130%
• High End: 188.5%
• Warning Cutoff: 247%
• Max DM Award: 32.5%
• Extreme Case Award: 48.75%

At its most basic, that really is a balance between competing forces of the quasi-party/solo atmosphere about NWN and the general low-adventuring-magic tendencies. Depending on who you ask, I'm guessing you'll find as many that think it needs to be higher as lower - kind of like the poll, but I think for now it's a decent stab at it.

Of course, I was hoping that the remainder of NWN1 could be a fertile test ground so that we can re-evaluate right at the start of the ALFA2 campaign. I don't believe any decision like that should be static.

[Nalo Jade]

money "sinks" suck IMHO.

generally they only help keep the little man down.

Fight the system. Kill Whitey. Word to the motherland.

[Magonushi]

[*]Average: 130%
[*]High End: 188.5%
[*]Warning Cutoff: 247%
[*]Max DM Award: 32.5%
[*]Extreme Case Award: 48.75%[/list]

Forgive me but your numbers make no sense at all. Warning cutoff is at two hundred and forty-seven percent of members?!?

[AlmightyTDawg]

247% of DMG "Average" value in Table 5-1. Meaning you'd have 2.5 times what an "average" PC should according to the DMG if you're at that value.

[LBaeldeth]

I think the most obvious and fair solution to all involved is to give me more money.