Planetouched for ALFA-NWN2

Nyarlathotep · Post by **Nyarlathotep** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 10:16 pm

Our PW has allowed LA adjusted characters for years, in fact they have been enabled since ALFA went Live so we aren't adressing the question of LA here at all. So the LA argument really shouldn't apply to this discussion since ALFA as a PW long ago made the choice to include LA races. Thus the status of plane touched in ALFA has nothing to do with whether or not we should allow LA in ALFA.

So we aren't addressing a matter of crunch here we are addressing a matter of fluff. So would plane touched be disruptive from an RP standpoint? Not really. Generally speaking the race they are most often compared to in FR sourcebooks are half elves. They aren't fire breathing monsters or covered in flames...they generally have one or two subtle signs of their nature. It might be horns or it could be a birthmark.

This comes back to the idea that there needs to be an argument made not include them.

Should they be banned because they are LA?

No. We already have LA races and more powerful ones to boot.

Are they unimmersive?

Not really. They are a canon part of the game world, though uncommon they are certainly not unheard of, and if the information taken from Races of Faerun or the FRCS is used they are no more disruptive to RP than HOs, less so in most cases.

Veilan · Post by **Veilan** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 11:17 pm

Ah, but you're mixing objective with subjective criteria here.

You can answer whether they are un-immersive as player characters only for yourself, since that's a call to be made by each individual participant. Again, noone contests they exist in FR, but there is a line between "your foe is a necromancer, so fiendish that he must have sprung from hell itself..." or "a Tiefling walks into a bar and joins your party...". I don't think anyone in ALFA is opposed to the former, but there seem to be some ALFAns to believe that the latter should only be done by a DM if they consider it appropriate flavour for the locale. Tolkienists may find different things immersive than X-menists. Is either of them more right than the other? Not really.

So far the tendency seems that arguments in favour of them as playing race are mostly subjective. "I find it fun to play one." or "they are part of FR, I want to be able to adventure with one in my party, not only see them as flavourful NPCs".

Arguments opposed seem to be objective - more workload (doesn't matter whether other races / characters already add - more is more), it's not actually done like that in a lvl 1 campaign, etc. (doesn't matter that we already went against this rule - that doesn't somehow make it an argument encouraging to do so again).

Of course, we can all draw our own conclusions from that discrepancy, and I think we have here ad nauseum.

psycho_leo · Post by **psycho_leo** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 11:37 pm

Alara wrote: Arguments opposed seem to be objective - more workload (doesn't matter whether other races / characters already add - more is more),

Of the two you presented, this argument is the only one that actually holds any water. But as it has been pointed out before, DMs are NOT forced in any ways to DM PCs or players they don't wish to. And I think we can all agree that players only stay where they get DM love. If you don't want planetouched PCs in your server, say so. You can't actually OOC force them out, but if they don't get DMed they'll just move to another server or start a more fitting PC.

Alara wrote: it's not actually done like that in a lvl 1 campaign, etc. (doesn't matter that we already went against this rule - that doesn't somehow make it an argument encouraging to do so again).

This only makes sense if you advocate against allowing Underdark races, at least until we actually get an underdark server. In fact they are more powerful than the planetouched, so it makes even less sense.

Alara wrote:Of course, we can all draw our own conclusions from that discrepancy, and I think we have here ad nauseum.

In that we can agree. Make a poll and get actual numbers. Until then this discussion is pointless.

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 2:07 am

psycho_leo wrote:Make a poll and get actual numbers. Until then this discussion is pointless.

Quite the contrary: 'actual numbers' are pointless without detailed discussion.

psycho_leo · Post by **psycho_leo** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 2:45 am

Rusty wrote:
psycho_leo wrote:Make a poll and get actual numbers. Until then this discussion is pointless.
Quite the contrary: 'actual numbers' are pointless without detailed discussion.

This discussion has been going on for ages. What we have now is just people throwing around the same arguments over and over. It has already served it's purpose as it is.

Rotku · Post by **Rotku** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 3:25 am

That's why, when I get time to put boht sides of the argument together, we will have a poll. But that won't be 'til early next week, unless anyone else wants to do the grunt work for me.

Veilan · Post by **Veilan** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 3:48 am

Rotku wrote:That's why, when I get time to put boht sides of the argument together, we will have a poll. But that won't be 'til early next week, unless anyone else wants to do the grunt work for me.

Hah, you need to get more staff. I hear they can be abused as cheap slave labour

.

Anyway, yeah - define proper criteria, then list pros and cons along them, start the weighing, and see.

Inaubryn · Post by **Inaubryn** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 4:49 am

Seriously... I have to do a documentary on ALFA. And I'm not jokin' or just pokin' fun. ALFA was born from a collection of gamers whose concept revolved around a persistent game world. It has morphed into what amounts to a pseudo-society with its own set of laws, politics, government, and social pretenses. It really has taken on a truly unique life of its own outside of the game. Obviously, most things here are still game related, either directly or indirectly, but wow.

I can't stress how dead serious I am right now. Have any of you guys ever sat back and just looked at this thing? I realize it may be hard to be objective, especially for those more deeply entrenched in the community and its politics but... wow! If ALFA is still goin' in a coupla' years, I am seriously goin' to do a documentary on its conception/inception and ultimate transformation into what it is now. I swear to you that this is the most socially fascinating thing I've come across in quite a long time. It's very self contained and not world-wide like hip-hop culture or anything that would be considered social phenomena, but man is this just fascinating. It just really kinda dawned on me now.

Now, nobody steal my idea.

Lusipher · Post by **Lusipher** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 4:54 am

You just now understanding this, Ina?

danielmn · Post by **danielmn** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:05 am

Inny, In the words of Godspeed

"We're trapped in the belly of this horrible machine...and the machine is bleeding to death..."

Rotku, I can vouch for what Alara said...and if you need further slave labor...look to your local martyr PADMS....

Rotku · Post by **Rotku** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:16 am

Well, I think I put that offer out before. If anyone wants to gather the pros and cons together nice and objectively, I'd be more than happy to let them

Rotku · Post by **Rotku** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:22 am

Anyway, this thread is close enough to ten pages and really just a repeat of arguments is all I'm seeing, so I'm going to lock this thread. For any outcry of "censoring" or any accusations of power abuse, please direct it to my lawyer.

Oh, and on the matter of staff, I have a handful of very good staff members, thank you very much. It's just they aren't exactly directly answerable to my every whim. Although I will take these suggestions to heart and make a policy of regularly whipping my staff, to keep them in line.