Arcane Archers...

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Keryn
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Arcane Archers...

Post by Keryn »

AA's... and the lack of info about them...

This situation bothers me a bit.. I have looked hard and there is almost no information on them that I could find. So if any of you found anything... please tell me where.

So far:

Ilsevele Miritar (coronal of Myth Drannor) is an AA(spellarcher).

Tsarra, Khelben's apprentice in the first Blackstaff novel, no lore but its mentioned Tsarra should take the path.

Site of WOTC has some info about the Mechanics of the class... no lore.
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070605

Anyone?
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Re: Arcane Archers...

Post by SwordSaintMusashi »

I am not sure there is much written up outside of the description of the class itself. Its a elven tradition (excluding drow, though they technically meet the prereqs), and it is considered a high honor among elven people to be an Arcane Archer.
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Re: Arcane Archers...

Post by Audark »

I know in the novels Ilsevele Miritar was an officer in the Queen's spell archers. To me that sounds as if there is an entire unit made up of spell archers, holding a prestigious place in the order of battle of Evermeet.

From this I do not think it is too much of a stretch to see this tradition fostered primarily in strong noble houses in the elven enclaves of Evermeet and Evereska, possibly finding a home as well in the reclaimed Myth Drannor.

At it's most fundamental it is just about applying the arcane to one's archery, so in the broad context someone could become a 'spell archer' without being a part of these military traditions. I expect however the prestige that goes along with that title, including the assumed leadership over 'elven warbands' as the write up goes, is directly tied to the military and social hierarchy of the elven homelands and is not merely a scattering of individuals here and there.

This is all of course speculation based on the barest of evidence, it's just what came to mind as reasonable given the available facts.
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Re: Arcane Archers...

Post by Keryn »

Guys the reason I posted this its not just for my own guidance. As in everything there is usually a small description of the lore/background of a class and this one... Nickles... nothing... some small mentions in some novels that don't add much to it other then speculation.

We have this PRC and we support it, Dms will eventually work with it and so will players. It would make sense for us to establish some base lore about it for ALFA players and DM to know with what they can count. Otherwise we might find ourselves looking at it, with people RPing it one way and others the opposite, Dms doing one things and other DM doing a totally different thing. It would be more a consistency check then other thing.

Its probably a singular case... a PRC that made it out to be sort of famous, included in a game and was done in such a rush they never got around to make something around it. And support it somehow in the FR lore.
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Re: Arcane Archers...

Post by kmj2587 »

There's no reason that the arcane archer should be treated identically by all players and DMs. One should be able to be played as the opposite of another. They may have nothing more in common than the class' mechanical features. There doesn't need to be any more lore for them than one finds about Eldritch Knights or any of the other "class + class = prestige class" PRCs. Arcane Archers are not a specific order or military group to build lore around. Audark mentioned that not all spell archers would have to be arcane archers, and conversely not all arcane archers would have to be spell archers.

The arcane archer is not a singular case. The arcane archer is one of the original 3.0/3.5e prestige classes included in the DMG. These classes were all given brief, vague descriptions without a great deal of detailed lore attached to them so that players and DMs could do with them as they wish. The only detailed lore you'll find about any of these classes is going to revolve around important NPCs who happen to have levels in them.
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Re: Arcane Archers...

Post by Veilan »

kmj2587 wrote:There's no reason that the arcane archer should be treated identically by all players and DMs. One should be able to be played as the opposite of another. They may have nothing more in common than the class' mechanical features. There doesn't need to be any more lore for them than one finds about Eldritch Knights or any of the other "class + class = prestige class" PRCs. Arcane Archers are not a specific order or military group to build lore around. Audark mentioned that not all spell archers would have to be arcane archers, and conversely not all arcane archers would have to be spell archers.

The arcane archer is not a singular case. The arcane archer is one of the original 3.0/3.5e prestige classes included in the DMG. These classes were all given brief, vague descriptions without a great deal of detailed lore attached to them so that players and DMs could do with them as they wish. The only detailed lore you'll find about any of these classes is going to revolve around important NPCs who happen to have levels in them.
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Re: Arcane Archers...

Post by Keryn »

kmj2587 wrote:...
These classes were all given brief, vague descriptions without a great deal of detailed lore attached to them so that players and DMs could do with them as they wish. The only detailed lore you'll find about any of these classes is going to revolve around important NPCs who happen to have levels in them.
Maybe this is where i see the problem and you two don't.

The only detailed lore is none. The brief description is so brief is barely a description, and if a DM running a campaign with his pnp group wished to establish what in his eyes is an AA he could and can do it perfectly, seems to work like a charm.

Though we play in a PW, and our DM, is actually a DM team, instead of one we have several who may by coincidence happen to think alike or not. Am i so out of line in thinking we should do exactly what your saying? Do as the DM feels like, but there must be something to base your RP in. I'm not saying a huge background "a la" 2ed, but some guidelines...

I can't RP a horse, if i don't know how a horse is, how he lives etc... Or we run the risk of having people RPing horses differently, in the end maybe to the eyes of the DM none of them is actually even a horse...

Maybe its just me...
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Re: Arcane Archers...

Post by Ithildur »

This doesn't have to be that complicated Keryn; get with the dm or HDM that's going to be overseeing your PRC development, and come up with something, perhaps including some of the thoughts Audark suggested and what you found about Miritar from whatever novel it's from. But otherwise, these guys are right; there is no extensive lore on most 3e/3.5e PRCs in existence other than the basic class descriptions, precisely for the reasons KMJ stated.

There are exceptions such as Bladesinger, which is an iconic class/prc/kit going back a ways to 2e with lots of fluff and some RP restrictions/requirements (and mentioned in nearly every novel/sourcebook that deals with elves), or Shadow Thief of Amn (obvious case where you need background/fluff), but these tend to be exceptions. There simply isn't extensive fluff for most of the basic 3.5e DMG PRC's, which are the ones that NWN2 has chosen to implement for the most part.

Even the bladesinger fluff, a fair amount of the fluff is non official really, stuff put together by knowledgeable people on the Candlekeep forums over the years (which gives it at least SOME air of respectability) and elsewhere by taking barely mentioned canonical references and expanding on them. i.e. various bladesinger lodges, cathshee style, the bladesinger's oath, etc.
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Keryn
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Re: Arcane Archers...

Post by Keryn »

Image

:P :chin:
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Re: Arcane Archers...

Post by CloudDancing »

The princple with prestige classes (at least from what I gathered in Alfa) is not knowing HOW to play one (unless you are a DM) but how to find a mentor for one and emulate that mentor through the various levels of the requirements.
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Re: Arcane Archers...

Post by Veilan »

I just see no reason to limit our roleplay unnecessarily. So maybe DM A interprets it a bit different than DM B. Worst thing that could happen: Arcane Archer A and Arcane Archer B meet... and interesting roleply ensues. Maybe one is a gold-elf armoured archer from Evermeet, and the other a vicious, unrefined sorcerous copper elf, or a half-elven bard who picked up a trick or two with his bow on his journeys during his stay in an elven enclave - there might be things to teach each other, or an interesting competition between their "schools".

I think people in ALFA have enough of an idea about the class not to play in a totally unfitting fashion... which you simply can't manage anyway, since the class and race requirements press it strongly into a certain direction anyway.

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Keryn
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Re: Arcane Archers...

Post by Keryn »

Veilan wrote:I just see no reason to limit our roleplay unnecessarily. So maybe DM A interprets it a bit different than DM B. Worst thing that could happen: Arcane Archer A and Arcane Archer B meet... and interesting roleply ensues. Maybe one is a gold-elf armoured archer from Evermeet, and the other a vicious, unrefined sorcerous copper elf, or a half-elven bard who picked up a trick or two with his bow on his journeys during his stay in an elven enclave - there might be things to teach each other, or an interesting competition between their "schools".

I think people in ALFA have enough of an idea about the class not to play in a totally unfitting fashion... which you simply can't manage anyway, since the class and race requirements press it strongly into a certain direction anyway.

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Re: Arcane Archers...

Post by Brother Humphrey »

I'd like to thank everyone who contributed to this thread, especially the OP. I'm very interested in this PrC and am hoping to find a DM willing to permit Del to find a mentor to take the required training to join the ranks of such a prestigeous cadre of warriors dedicated to the protection of the woodlands and all that jazz. Perhaps one of these days, I'll even manage to find which of my 20 spare hard drives has all my FR and 3ed and 3.5ed soure material pdfs to read up a bit more to get the proper (subjective, of course) flavour.
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